First I just read that thread "Top Author Ranking" by T-Man;
about bots and cookies. All I have to say is that is just sad, it really is.

I have to agree with some of what Armani and a few others have said. There is no question we do this because we truly enjoy doing it. First and foremost I create for ME. Because I am incomplete unless I am creating something, whether it be on pc, or with real paint or writing. However,no artist can deny that when they create something that they are quite proud of, seeing the healthy download count,it DOES make you feel good! I love it when I make something that I thought was good, and I see you guys downloading it, or hear of how great you think it looks on your DT, it makes me happy that I provided that! It's not about needing acceptance or a low self esteem, it's about "Hey I love doing this, their liking it...maybe I'm not too bad at this,eh? " If I were to only get 1 download for my next creation; would I stop creating? NOPE!Because in the end I do create for ME! I was toying with graphics for a couple of years, before I ever submitted a thing to any site. Would I like to hit Top Authors...sure!

Darn it, I am rambling again, I do that too much

Anywhoo, my point is, if this change in the Top Authors list makes things more fair, and is for the greater good of ALL artists. That is fantastic! As I read the T-Man thread it sounds like that is what they are really working hard at doing. And I think we should support it! Because to me it sounds like they are trying to think of 'us' the authors, ALL of us. And I think that is really cool.

To be honest, I was so happy when I logged on today, and saw Dark Mist on that Top Authors list!!! I thought that was just the coolest thing. Does that mean I was happy to see Adni18 drop down a couple of notches. NO!!! It means I was happy for Dark Mist! Adni18's popularity is well known, and his work has inspired many an artist, something we're all grateful for. His designs have obviously adorned many a DT, and been enjoyed by artists and users alike. NO ONE can take that away from him!!!!!! He is very talented. I am in no way going to do Adni Bashing as I do think he is extremely talented. But I have to say, as someone who has been inspired by his work, and enjoyed it, used it on my own DT, and hell looked at it and it made me work harder and try to be a better artist. As one artist to another even if I am newbie in comparison to him, I am quite concerned that he has forgotten why he's doing this. It's not all about numbers, and ratings. Yes they're great , and he's good...nothing is going to change that, nor can. But of late I'm sorry there seems to be a great deal of intensity over ratings and who's really number one. NO ONE wants to see him go and stop creating as we all love his work, but that doesn't seem to be enough "Reward" for Adni.
And Adni if that sounded like I was bashing you I genuinely apologize as that was not the intent, I was merely trying to point out that you are talented, people love what you do, and I hope that you remember those that wait for your next creation before you make choices over numbers.

davad, it's so much that way. It's not that the featured skin had his download disregarded.
From what I understand it's the skincast feature in Windowblinds that wasn't counted. If I'm right, it means that when a Windowblinds skin is featured on skincast, then for users who have that feature enabled, Windowblinds will show a screenshot of that skin in your Appearance menu, where you can automatically download it and apply it. Those downloads were not counted before, and that was not fair because the skins actually were indeed downloaded and applied.
At least, that's how I understand it.

Do I cry because I am not on top? no, it does not means you are not good skinner.

From https://www.wincustomize.com/msgboard.asp?BID=WC&id=144016#144472 WOM's thread "Top Authors"
_______________________
#13 by adni18 - 5/4/2003 12:39:05 AM
I am not coplaining and I don't care either, but the true Top Authors list for Saturday, May 03, 2003 is about:

adni18 5500
pasley 4500
starone 4000
mormegil 3500
etc

I don't know where those numbers I see today, Sunday, May 04, 2003 are comming from
___________________________

So how many hundreds or thousands or millions of downloads does it take for an author to feel his/her work is appreciated? Is it that important to be #1 on this site even if that number may not reflect only the downloads pulled directly from this site but includes those pulled from links on other sites? Why not ask and find out what the numbers truly represent before jumping to conclusions and taking off in a huff? Why no concerns about the methodology or whether it's been actually fair to the other uploaders here who may not have their work uploaded to as many sites as you as long as you're #1 here?

You've always been #1 so any change in methodology must be unfair to or directed at you? Even if it turns out that your work may not really be #1 in downloads pulled directly by users on this site? What a shock that must be. Sorry, but this is an unbecoming snitfest IMO.

Does this mean you refuse to upload work to this site unless you are rated #1? Even if you are not actually #1 in downloads by users of this site? Well then...OK.

Thank you Lady Akasha...came as quite a shock to me when i logged on.

But a very nice suprise

Will be seeing you up there and others too very soon

You're welcome Dark Mist, and congrats

Thank you, oh and congrats on your Madam...sorry if you've had it a while, never noticed

ummm... I don't understand the andi bashing... I don't think he is saying he does work to be on the top of the list.

I think he is saying he knows that he has made thousands (literally) of skins and wall that get downloaded consitantly and that should show on the top download list in all fairness. This is why andi is a mainstay on the list. Others might get hi downloads in a day or week but after that the skin is forgotten or just not as downloaded.


and for those who quote andi's words, please understand english is not his first language, ask him to clarify. My first post alluded to some more clarification (I guess I should have just asked )

To me, it is plain that they (the site) is trying some new formula because, as I wrote before, allot of the time in months past the download number next to the name was closer to the 600 numbers than 200...

just wait and see what is done. Then we all can complain about it later

Reading all these posts, make me wonder if by mistake I have opened this thread using Greek instead of English….

I am not complaining because I am not no1 at the Top Authors List, which list by the way is using wrong numbers.
I just can’t stand the unfairness and if fighting for fair is a crime, then crucify me.

I see a lot of confusion in many posts and I think it is done for purpose.

I never said that I am the best either, there are a lot of people with great talent among us, which I respect and they are better than me.

I guess, that this is my last post, which I am sure that those who understand what is going on, they have get the message, for the rest, I am sorry I can’t do nothing more.

Things have gone further than they needed to.

adni18 : »"I am not complaining because I am not no1 at the Top Authors List, which list by the way is using wrong numbers."

Please see T-Mans post about how the top author ratings are being calculated now. I think that he went over i quite thoroughly. Top total download does not = top author due to issues that he mentioned.

This is the second threat or third now that I consider a shame. Adni, sometimes I think You have 2 personalities, sorry to say that. I was in the top list 1 time for 1 day (and that was in the beginning of the site) and then never again. So did I lose fun ? No ! (Although I don't compare myself to You and others). There are so many great skinners here, that never make it into the top list. I barely look at it nowadays, because there are the same names for such a long time that I completely lost interest looking at it. That's the same as with my musical taste : I don't care for charts because I have my own taste... If You do skinning to be on the top list. please quit. I think You have become too big in a too short time. Together with that other post You wrote about ratings I must say that I lost a big piece of respect for You, sadly. I will never forget Your nice comments on skins from others (including mine) but I also have to notice the things negatively that are going on from Your direction lately...

I have read all the posts in regard to this issue of Top Authors. And I think if we really want to be fair, the correct thing to do is feature 2 lists. One with the over all Top Authors and another with the featured Top Author for the day, week or month (how ever management figures) This way there's a equality of fairness on both sides of the artists group.
As a new artist my self, I can understand how some new artists want to be awknowlege or noticed, specially if they are doing great work. When my name appeared on the Top 10, I must admit it felt real nice to see it there.
But I also see where Adni and other season artist feel when they are in the lead of overall Top Authors, and their names dont show or show below artists that have few overall downloads.

So, on the spirit of fairness, I hope we can see the 2 lists soon.

Hmmm...

umm, Adni they're experimenting with a new way of doing it... they never said this is the way it would be.

... i can understand your frustrations and it's sad to see you go... but as stated before if making the top downloads is such a big deal for you, you are doing this for the wrong reasons... I make stuff and know that I will NEVER be in the top authors... yet that doesn't make me leave. rather, I just make more stuff and don't up it because I know it won't be enjoyed by many people except myself...

so, good bye then.

Your up there twice DM. That skin I made featured your wall Congrats

I hate to even comment on the subject of this thread. This is the second one in as many weeks, by the same person, lamenting the same topic. I almost posted earlier , typed about a paragraph, and just closed the window. It's been bugging me all day. I was pretty surprised to see where I wound up today on that list. I saw my download numbers moving like never before and knew I'd end up somewhere in the top ten. People were downloading my new skin. It was being well recieved, better than I hoped as I was a little disappointed in it myself and its got a few quirks that I just dont have the knowledge to fix yet.
I'd be lying if I said it didnt feel good to see your name there, but thats not why I am here. I am here coz this is way fun. I make what I like and share it. My "reward", my self-satisfaction grows from a few different channels. First, my own feelings about what I have made. After that, once I've shared it here, of course I have an interest in what others "think" of it. It's a piece of myself. How do I gauge? How do I judge if I've done something to be proud of. Obviously I will watch my downloads, and I look at the ratings here as the popular vote.
But for myself, the greatest reward here, is the comments. It's humbling (that should be in caps) The people's "voice". The names that go with those numbers. The comments put faces on those abstract numbers. Ive met people here, forged new associations, given and recieved help, collaborated. Emails and comments here from the actuall people downloading and using my work, telling me in their words how they feel, what they think, whats right or wrong and why. And I always try to reply. Priceless and REWARDING.
And now I see a movement growing to feature new artists, and I am quietly rooting for it. It wont benefit me as much since I guess I am in that "in-between" place. Not so new, not so well established as others. I think it would be great for those newcomers, with talent or skill or just imagination and new ideas . I envy these new talents who will enter with that opportunity that I missed out on. I remember, feeling like a small fish in big ocean, and I still feel that way coz this site is a big ocean.
I am grateful for this sites existence coz I found a channel for something I love to do. Grateful to the people who accepted me and encouraged me. Then I see this again, and I hope I'm getting it wrong. But I'm reading and re-reading and I still see the same thing. Someone crying and willing to quit coz they lost the number 1 slot for a day, or their ratings slid on a few walls. I wish I had the skills to bust out a wall fitting of this site. Maybe someday.
If I'm wrong, I truly apologize... I want to be wrong. I'm not looking to bash anyone here, least of all a talented and accomplished skinner. Just seems that priorities are often misplaced. Maybe I just misunderstood and again, I am sorry, but either way I felt the need to express my feelings on the whole DL/Rating/Lists "thing".

Jason

I'm only up there thanks to you Ingui

Which numbers are the "wrong" numbers, Adni? The ones that only show downloads on this site? Or the ones that show downloads from this site *and* downloads as a result from links on other sites? That, evidently is the main difference according to FB above. And if it really didn't matter, would you raise the issue?

Joe, I understand Adni's first language isn't English, but I believe his command of the language is sufficient to say, "I don't care and I'm not complaining" in one thread and then care very much and say it's unfair in another. I'm really not "bashing" Adni as I know he's a generous and talented fellow. Generous to other artists as well. But I do think he's gone off a bit half cocked without sufficient information and jumped to conclusions that the system is being "rigged" somehow in order to dethrone him from the number #1 spot. There's a difference (evidently) between #1 in downloads only by users of this site and #1 total overall downloads including other sites who have linked to here. What's wrong with having both numbers? What is wrong is if Adni doesn't want to know what the numbers represent because he's fixating on one number and avers that any other representation specific to this site only must be "wrong."

I just think he should have first investigated to determine what methodology was and is now being used and what the prior and current numbers actually represent before saying it's "unfair." In the earlier thread people were advised not to pay attention to to the numbers for a few days as they're trying to figure out what's a more equitable way of presenting the numbers for *this* site. And presumably it shall be explained as in the T-man thread, not hidden away in some dark conspiracy against a certain author.

I can't help but feel bothered that soooo many people are seriously ganging up on Nikos for feeling the way he does.

If nothing else put yourself in his shoes. Being the number one D/L author for days, weeks, and months on end....and now that's gone. You say that's not a big deal, well your saying it from a prespective of never even attaining what he has. Satisifaction and reward are relative here since none of us are making money off of what we are doing on this site, so if a few of you take pride in knowing that your work made it on...great! For others who actually look at it as a challenge and make attempts to be the best...even better! I find it hard to believe that anyone of you have not been in either or both of the two I just mentioned above.....that's like saying "all" of you bought your version of Bryce, Photoshop, or whatever suits your fancy.

I almost feel like he is Microsoft and has been regulated so that his part of the software market is controlled. I myself have ony been on the "List" once for like an hour or something probably......whatever the outcome I just hope you don't decide to leave Nikos......a core of artists is what made this site what it is and I can't but help feel that your roll was one of the biggest and this is how you are treated

It always is this 'conspiracy' undertone that bugs me... NOONE of the admins and 99,9+% of the people here is willing to do You any harm, Adni...

I'm with Hippy........... who needs a stinking list?

Ganging up on Adni? Because some of us (or at least I) think Adni should check his facts before crying "foul" and having a snit? That's what's frustrating. He did it on another thread before, making allegations without first determining the facts. I'd have that same response to anyone who did that, regardless of how many skins and downloads they had or did not have. It's Adni's choice to go if he wishes but I think it's based on an erroneous premise. That's what I would like him to try and consider.

Wrong or right I just feel the approach to enlighten him is being done in poor taste. That is my 'opinion', I myself don't understand fully whats going on but as it seems right now....the top author list is misleading, and there is better ways of telling him "See ya, and close the door behind you".

Well I thought his threads and allegations were in poor taste, myself. If he intends to go because the numbers don't suit him, should the methodology for Top Authors on this site which is now limited to downloads by users of this site be dumped (even if it is unfair to others here) just to please him? That's evidently what he's asking for. That's blackmail. That's not in particularly good taste or admirable either.

sig101,
Because you insisting to abuse me, I have to answer.

What are you talking about?
Did you read my post? Do you think that you know the facts?
If you did, which I am sure you don't, you couldn't talk that way.