hrm, thought the thread was created by l0c - ahh, it was.

hypocrite used incorrectly? nazi was an insult, it offended people, but the same people it offended also insult people - even the one person who called into querstion the acceptibility of hurling insults didn't deny ever making them (& no, of course it isn't "acceptable" to hurl them in my locale; doesn't stop anyone, though.)

asslicker being the incorrect perjorative? hrm, probably. it went well w/ the flow of the sentence . the sheep analogy was more on target, but i needed a needle for the sting at the end... ah well, i'll attempt to craft better if the situation arises.

Saying something good about someone is a bad thing? nah. well, it can be - "damn with faint praise" is an old expression. my objection isn't to the "brad is good" comments - it's to the "l0c used the n-word and is now a bad person, and other people are, of course, good by comparison".

hi? oh yeah. hi, doreen, paxx, jafo, crae, china, tast & trans.

Yikes, I "almost" feel insulted..

Hey Shog! Good to see you again. I hope you stick around.

Oh shog shog shog. The long fall you've taken. You just basically said that calling people Nazi is acceptable but saying nice things about people is bad.

emily: then i've failed... basically, i was trying to say that all insults are bad, but deal with it because they're gonna happen.. and most of the nice things being said in this particular thread are said to further vilify l0c by comparison...

You called us hypocrites shoggot. In all my years hanging out on kuro5hin I have never created a new topic just to flame somebody. l0c is being villified because he is a villain. he has nobody but himself to blame. If he wants to get some respect back he should admit he was wrong and say he is sorry.

Stardock/Brad = Correct
l0c = Dead Wrong!

l0c, do you own the hosting servers? Do you pay for the bandwith?

I don't care what your "role" is in the administration/creation of this site (if any), you don't have any rights if you're not footing the bill. Stardock has every right to control what goes on here. Why he deleted the post is not relevant whatsoever. I don't care why he did it. The fact remains he has the right to do what the h3ll he wants.

Saying Stardock "censored" the post is like saying Fox "censors" its interviewed people when they call CNN a bunch of liars. If I were Brad I wouldn't want competing products "advertised" on my site...period.

l0c, please go somewhere else to spout your "I'm a victim" garbage to someone who cares.

Brad is the good guy.
loc is the bad guy...
I wish life was so simple...

Ok, so loc got carried away and said harsh things without taking time to know why it happened. That was wrong. But he is not a demon. He was impulsive and he's bitting his tongue now. I'll remind you that a lot of people write impulsively sometimes, and Brad himself too.

Really people, take a few steps back, take a few days to put thing in perspective. So the word Nazi was used inapproprietly, so I've read the word "gay" used inappropriately often too. Wrong choice of words, impulsive reaction. He made a mistake. Now lets turn the page.

"Brad is the good guy.
loc is the bad guy...
I wish life was so simple..."

I didn't say "good" or "bad". I wrote "correct" and "Dead-Wrong". No, life is not so simple, but this issue is. From both a legal and ethical angle it is quite simple.

I actually didn't have a problem with the "nazi"...I couldn’t care less. My problem is with l0c behaving like a "I have a right to everything for nothing" cry-baby. There should be some responsibility for his childish behavior.

"He made a mistake. Now lets turn the page."

There should be some responsibility for his "mistake" (childish behavior). Now he should pay the price for the mistake: An apology (at the very least).

Orion, I was targeting your post specifically, but the whole "loc is evil" feeling that seems to emanate from this thread.
As for apologies, man... How often have I seen offensive posts towards me or others from people I won't name. How often have I wished to read an apology. Never read one. But I've turned the page, I'm in excellent terms with those people now.

"Really people, take a few steps back, take a few days to put thing in perspective. So the word Nazi was used inapproprietly, so I've read the word "gay" used inappropriately often too. Wrong choice of words, impulsive reaction. He made a mistake. Now lets turn the page. " - Paxx

Paxx if that is truely the case then why hasn't l0c submitted an apology to Brad. Public or Private. It hasn't happened!

How many topics have been created on this message board that existed only to make a personal attack? l0c's is the first I know of. When Brad calls someone a nazi or a "f*ckhead" or whatever, let me know.

I would like to mention that this post isn't about (at least I didn't mean for my part to be) an l0c versus Brad post. It was simply stating for once the "good" feelings towards Brad versus bad stuff that is thrown at him.

We haven't heard from l0c since he posted his thread (at least not that I've seen), so nobody knows why he said what he did.

oops...sorry, I meant the other thread, not this thread (been switching back and forth too much and confusing myself.......which isn't too hard!)

hey shog! heh hows life treating ya?

sure l0c is wrong to use "nazi" but people is also wrong to flame him so heavily.

the road goes both ways. 2 wrongs dont make a right. whatever the saying goes.

as of rights this website is ran by company. like i said up there its a dictorshop. now, thats not a bad word ( expecially dictorship called wincustomize heh )

this site is no more a dictatorship than any other site. and l0c has just experienced the back lash of the silent majority me thinks. we're so fed up of seeing people getting away with bashing people, usualy brad, that as a collective group we've said ENOUGH. it's given me renewed hope for this community.

I've lost all hope. I give up. Feel free to choose your bad guy and bash away. I'm sure it will make him a better person afterwards.

Nah. No dictatorship here. Some of the admins may work for SD, but others don't. Then there are the moderators, the masters, the journeymen and whatever more titles there are here. All of them determine what goes on here. The Frog from time to time shares his concerns about the bandwidth problem and what SD has to pay for it. He has these discussions in the open. And yes, he should have a final word from time to time, because it is a costly operation. Does that make him a dictator or an open business man?

Please Paxx, don't give up. We need people like you.

Paxx - l0c ain't a bad guy. I don't know the guy. But he was wrong. Very wrong. That is all they are saying. Even good guys are wrong sometimes. I would think we should be more worried for the community if someone could create a post calling someone a Nazi and that people didn't object.

If l0c was really sorry why he is not here? Just think he needed to know that he has gone too far, it's hurting. I think it could help if l0c was giving excuses. He can be mad on Brad or anyone else, we are talking here about respect. If Brad created a thread to treat someone else, I would be against that too.

I Just think latetly some peoples don't think twice before writing something that can hurts feelings. Not only l0c did that. I did not reject l0c but I reject his attitude and if he persists I will come back and tell what I don't like. There is a way to tell things without treating. I think everyone should learn on this situation. I'm tired of fighting threads.

To most of you who know who I am, I have just joined this site....

I have watched and read this thread and I am appauled at what is being
said here. First of all you better go back and read this thread again.

Title: "Brace yourselves, the warez kiddies are attacking"
Last sentence;
You may use the space below to vent on me for being a facist censoring
bastard or whatever.

by Vagrant Frogboy - 10/21/2001 12:45:35 AM

The way I see it 10c has every right to use the wording he chose.
Afterall Frogboy called himself a fascist censoring bastard or whatever
and that leaves a lot of room for all sorts of remarks in any thread.

fascist-adj.of Fascists or Fascism; believing in or practicing fascism.
a) a member of the Fascisti-b) a member of some similar party; Nazi,
Falangist, etc. person who believes in fascism.

Fascism; a system of government characterized by rigid one-party
dictatorship, forcible suppression of opposition, private economic
enterprise under centralized governmental control, belligerent
nationalism, racism, and militarism, etc.

Granted, this is his site to do as he wishes, and if he wants to
delete a News item on the front page or delete a thread. He has
every right to it. However, he should stand by his decisions and
take the flak that comes with it. All I see Frogboy do is start
similar controversial threads and then leave......

But then again if I were him I would probably do the same thing.
Cause He has all of you to protect him. As a matter fact he should
add another handle, and call himself "Shepherd" because he has quite
a large flock following him......Now I think the heat is off 10c...
lol lol

Blah!

Well i'm surprised to see so much chaos in what's been a fairly mellow community since the demise of skinz.org and deskmod.

Funny thing is i'm not surprised at who is causing much of the chaos. Feels like i'm back in #skinnerz. Where i had the same problems with the same people. Thought you guys were over this kind of stuff. Its way more than a year later and i'd like to think we've all grown a bit and got over this petty shit.

As far as deleting a post, whoever pays the bill for the bandwidth for this site gets to do whatever the fuck they want. Sorry but this is a private site open to the public.. like any website is. Not the other way around.

Shoggot: welcome back . Long time no read. How goes the new job? Bet the hours are better

-Jesh

Man, I left for a few days. I come back, and this is the first thread I see. (Hard to miss with such an intriguing title).

I won't pass judgement on I0c as a person, or on Brad as a person, based purely on this situation; that wouldn't be fair to either of them. But I will pass judgement on their actions:

Brad deleted a news item submitted by I0c due to its potential legal ramifications for liable/slander (never understood the difference...). I0c, in turn, got mad at Brad for doing so and called Brad names (or *a* name, at least). Then a bunch of people got together and took sides.

Like I said, I don't think I0c is a bad person based on this thread. I have far too little info to make that sort of leap in judgement. But I *do* think his actions were *very* wrong concerning this issue. Not just for his choice of words, but how he chose to deal with his feelings.

There are a number of places for people to go and vent when they're angry. There are even a few that condone the sorts of personal attacks that occurred here. But *this* place is not one of them. This is a community site, and degrading personal attacks have no place here.

I'm relieved to see the swelling of support for Brad in this, but not just because it's for Brad; I believe it's good because it shows that there are many people who feel the same way I do, that a community site isn't the right place for this sort of crap.

At the same time, I'm disappointed with some people coming on here and saying "Cut I0c some slack..." Um, no. However great of a guy he might be, he was simply wrong to make that sort of statement in a community setting. Private email to Brad, sure, if that's what makes him feel better. But in a *public*, *community-oriented* forum, it's severely misplaced.

And speaking out against this kind of behavior is *not* hypocritical. Have I called someone names at some point in my life? You betcha! But do I do so in public community forums? Not since I graduated elementary school.

The point is this just isn't the place for this kind of behavior. I have left message boards when thy've devolved into this sort of petty crap. And I know I'm not this site's biggest contributor, and no massive swelling of support/pleading would result from my saying "I can't take this anymore; I'm leaving"; but it would be a real shame to see this site fall because of the childish repsonses from a couple of members, followed by *support* for that kind of behavior!?!

Forgive me for once again writing a book. But I *do* think I0c was wrong, and I think the only fitting response at this point would be a public apology for this (since the insult was made in public after all). And I don't care if it was Brad or Citizen JoeSchmoe who was it's original target. It's simply misplaced here.