Are Mac users better skinners?

why, even compare apples to lushes ripe peaches?

...that would be 'luscious', Oh Luscious One

whatever

Well, between Konfabulator and DesktopX, you've said the same yourself before Frogboy. They're both the same, and they're both different.

DesktopX is a wonderful app (I can only assume it still is. I like my old beta still! ^_^) but Konfabulator has the nice feature of OSX's Unix core, allowing it to tie in with other apps (such as top).. but still, Konfabulator's always reminded me as more of a more-graphical Samurize than DesktopX anyway.

As for the quality of the skins/widgets between Apple and PC? Hrm... I don't know. Really, I bet if you took the best of the best from the Apple side as well as the best of the best from the PC side, you'd find that if nothing else, the #s were about the same for both.

kthxbye: DesktopX can tie in with other apps too:

That's two DesktopX objects available for download that embed Flash inside. That gives DesktopX a pretty huge advantage.

But having use Konfabulator, its objects are, on average, slicker than DesktopX objects. DesktopX's weather is nice. But Konfabulator's has nicer images and smoothly slides in and out to an expanded mode.  There's more polish in the skins I've seen for the Mac, on average.

There also seems to be more skinners per capita among the Mac users. I'm quite concerned about the ratio between skinners and users. In the old days, there were a lot of skinners when compared to the number of users.

But these days, a handful of skinners seem to be supplying the entire community on Windows.

 

 

I dunno I use both, just depends on the situation, or job requirements. But as I've always argued with my "mac is lord almighty" biased staff, proffesors and students. Making a new folder on a mac is different than it is for making a new folder on pc, but operating system aside, and blind views behind it, the programs (i.e. photoshop, 3ds max) are no different on mac or pc. There are advantages and disadvantages of both, but artist wise? Thats a dumb question, about as dumb as asking which has better drivers, ford or chevy? ...but besides that I think pc users are just as bias as mac users.
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anyone have a link to a MAC skin/theme on the same level of design and presentation as say, CopperDeckII, Beacon, Sputnik, PixOffice, XBox, Imdemnity and any number of other DesktopX Themes and or Windblind Skins?

If so I sure would like to see it because from what my son has on his laptop, my cousing has on her new dual G4 and her G4 laptop and two other friends G4's they (MAC skinners) are all rippers who make claims of fame from ropping that single half pipe and colored orbs for button with different textures and creative wall papers.

A nail is a nail is a nail is a nail and they all seem to reach into the same box when they grab one...

hmm thats a tough one, i guess you couldn't really compare as it is a different layout of desktops.

Only two guys i know of thats probably top class for the Mac, like Pixtudio/SkinPlant is for the PC would be Max Rudberg and William Bart.

Max Rudberg's

Aluminum Alloy

http://homepage.mac.com/max_08/





and Bill Bart http://www.bbxstudio.com


I couldn't say Mac users are rippers IPlural because if you look at it both sides, Mac and PC designers have their good and bad community its just knowing the right people
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I think Windows has the best themes. I don't know much about Mac themes, but there are not a lot of quality themes for Linux, and Linux just doesn't seem to be as skinnable as a Windows system loaded with Object Desktop plus other Stardock products that change the way the GUI looks. I can't imagine spending a lot of money on a Mac then being stuck only using the Aqua theme with the same shell style.

Anyone that's been on one of the mailing lists for the Mac skinning programs knows that Mac users are pretty convinced that they're a lot better at skinning (and are convinced that PC users are a bunch of rippers -- a charge, that while over generalized, we all have seen how little respect some people have for the rights of skinners).

It makes me mad too that many Mac users would convict all Windows skinners as being reppers? They must have looked at a site like themexp.org and drew a conclusion from that. At another site I was arguing with a bunch of Linux zealots that Windows has the best looking themes and that skinning on Windows via Object Desktop plus other Stardock products was light years ahead of Linux's native skinnability. It just makes me made that this one zealot accused me of being a lyer and made the accusation that Stardock products hack Windows.

As a proud owner of a new G5 I must say that that Konfabulator looks and runs much better than DX for me on Windows Media Center . The Widgets blend in so well with any desktop choice where as the Objects in DX can look very gawky and obtrusive . I have not had much luck with Objects at all . Either do not work at all or max out CPU for a simple mail checker . I have tried many but now only will use Icon X because of the constant battle with DX objects . With DX loading at start up I had lots of trouble where Konfabulator loads with no problems at all . With Expose a mouse movement can clear all Widgets , very smoothly from the screen and return them just as smoothly as you removed them . Very useful to me . I am using 9 Widgets with no noticeable CPU rev up at all . If I were to use that many Objects I would most likely be frozen solid and may even crash . I don't know if the Konfabulator will have any more luck than DX in the Windows environment but the Konfabulator in the Apple environment is clearly the best choice for me .

brazil, ok, but what about the creativity, not a disection of the apps and the issues you have faced with them (not everyone has been through exactly what you have been through with the programs or computers (though I do not have a clue as to what you've been through with them))

Voodoo_Freak I like those and they really look sweet, but excluding a few astetic changes, they are a hald pipe, orbs and some textures...

I am not trying to take anything away form them in the least. Much better than I can do without a doubt. But, I feel the dynamic is totally different when looking to skin on a MAC and skinning on a PC. For someone to claim such a thing as 1. MAC skinners are more creative is a reach in my opinion and 2. to claim that all PC skinners are ripping (thieves another words) is down right ignorant...

I do believe the quality of Mac skins is highly superior to what we can do on the Windows side. That stems from, as Brad said, more graphics proffesionals using Macs.
Just take a look through the archive of themes and schemes at Kaleidoscope, and you'll see way more creativity and originality. The fact that probably about 60% of MSStyles are Mac ports, and about 30% of WB skins in the last year and a half have been WB ports of MSStyle ports of Mac themes shows people are preffering to use them than make something unique.

I certainly don't think it comes down to programs involved. Using Kaleidoscope of Konfabulator doesn't make you a better skinner. It's what you can do in a graphics prog that dteremines that. And that brings it back to the point of more pro's using the Mac.

If you want to see any really mind blowing work for Windows, you generally need to look in the Winamp scene. Outside that, Pixtudio and Skins factory are probably the only people producing truly outstanding stuff.

Yup, what the hipster said.

Since Apple seems to have such a stranglehold on the whole graphics design industry, the ratio of people that actually have the skills to create good stuff is much better on the Mac side of life than in PC land. PC's are more for the average Joe who likes to drink beer and watch sports.

But... that has nothing to do with the system and more with the old prejudice that if you wnat to be a graphics designer you should work on a Mac.

I own a Mac, but use a PC to do all my design work, I guess that means I will never get anywere as a Designer..... Oh poor me, what will become of poor moremegil in the end.

thats ok mormegil, you can come visit and we'll go fishing though it's a bit cold right now theses days, mmm, think it is getting down into the high 70's to low 80's today

Sides, your an Artie`st hell with Designer

Brazil, if you're having those kinds of problems with DesktopX objects you should be talking to support. You should also make sure you use objects that say they are designed for DesktopX.

Which object or objects have you had troubles with?

I tend to agree with Hippy though his 30% figure is way way overstated. There were about 600 new WB visual styles created last year. 30% would be 180. No where near that many Mac ports were there. More like 10 to 20 I would bet which would be only a couple percent.

I do agree that Kaleidoscope skins show more originality on average, particularly over msstyles. On the other hand, WB skinners tend to be more (overly?) concerned with popularity and those generic looking minimalistic skins are, for whatever reason, the most popular.

Just a thought ... but maybe the idea that Windows skinners are 'ripping' the work of Mac skinners comes from so many Windows skinners trying to emulate Mac type buttons (glassy/gel), at least in WindowBlinds skins. If you look at some of the older WB skins, you don't see as much of the glassy buttons, whereas the popular ones now are mostly glass button types.

Even though they don't get the popularity/downloads, I like seeing the new WB skins that strike out from the current mold to do something original.

Look how many come in and do not even search the library only to beg for links to MAC sytle skins...

Heck doing a search is almost at the level of reading the doc's for some

Frogboy said: “But these days, a handful of skinners seem to be supplying the entire community on Windows.”

If what I describe doesn’t apply to anyone else, consider it one Jackass’s opinion. I have been discouraged from skinning because of all this, and I need to get over it. I don’t think we have much appreciation for the skilled hobbyist in our community. The Mac community doesn’t seem to feel the same.

Contrary to the recollection of some, I never predicted commercialism to be the death of skinning. I thought it would be the death of the elite hobbyist. Was I all that wrong? Elite skinners aren't filling the sections with gems, they are only giving us a couple of skins a year, and for one or two apps. The ‘best-of-the-best’, for-hire skins are mind-bogglingly great, but most are heavily-branded by those outside of the community, FOR those outside the community, most often for an exclusive app. Where are the SkinsFactory quality skins made just for the hell of it to the delight of their peers? Wasn’t that the mood in the beginning? Isn’t that the mood with the Mac folks?

I believe hobbyists are the ones that make or break this community. I was really alienated when I was told that I was foolish for not turning our hobby into a business by numerous people, over and over. The same could be said for any hobby; model airplanes to knitting. The hobbyist wants to make his own masterpiece for its own sake, regardless of compensation. Commercial endeavors are for the PUBLIC and the PUBLIC just wants something slick to match their Harry Potter lunchbox, or at least something mediocre with some Harry Potter stickers glued on. Personal interpretation of commercialism and ‘fan art’ aside, skilled hobbyists are alienated by such mainstreaming, and they are less apt to contribute and associate because of it.

That was what I thought then, and though I wish I had stated my concerns differently, I still feel the same. I have also accepted that there is nothing that can be done about it. The downloader is going to dictate the site, not the skinner.

I can fix my own attitude, though. I just have to stop being ashamed that I'm not producing commercially and do it for the love of the art. I also need to stop focusing on those without the creativity to make their own art. That, too, discourages us from creating and sharing. We aren’t benefiting ourselves by watchdogging and warring, we should be out-producing them and over-shadowing them with quality.

The spotlight needs to return to what made the community great in the first place, amateur artists creating beautiful skins just because they LOVE to make beautiful skins. That is what you see in the Mac community, I think, and what we have lost.

Some intersting thoughts there BakerStreet.

For sure the proportion of skinners vr users is much higher in the mac world due to the fact the graphic designing industry practically kept the mac alive singlehandedly for many years.

For that reason the chances of more high-quality skins "per capita" from the mac world is more likely.

On the other hand the research and development balance tips so heavily in favor of the pc's, I think in the end that will the deciding factor in answering Frogboy's question.

* warning, blatant plug coming*
In terms of computer desktop interface modification there are alternatives to the commercial products, for example Litestep. Although not always for the faint of heart, it's an extremely powerfull way to change the way your computer looks and works.
*end plug *

er, Frogboys implied question being: which skinning direction will flourish.

I have to say that when I was using my mac, My wife has it now. That I did not find that the skinning, at least the themes, were few and far betweeen. I can think of about 3 skins that I liked, and the rest were about average. As far as Konfabualter goes, there are some nice objects, but if you look past the first few pages in the widget gallery there is a pritty high count of week, to crappy stuff.
 As a person who has had to do design on both I have to say, that the biggest problem with the Windows side of skinning is that there are ALOT more people doing it. And there for there is more bad stuff vissable, simple math says that the more people doing it the lower the average is going to be. I for one will take a Treetog or a MikeB over any of the skinners I have seen in the Mac world.

Bakerstreet, you've gotta get a blog going on JoeUser. That was an excellent post. I'm not sure how much I agree with it (have to think about it more) but it's really thought provoking.

Frogboy: yup, thanks. I registered there a couple of weeks ago. I've been playing with DesktopX 2 in my spare time and haven't done much with it. I'll look in again soon.


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