Is Shmoopy Right?

There is some very strange things going on around here lately.

I think there may still be some server problems with updating. I had the same problem trying to fix one of my latest offerings, but it eventually was updated correctly.

I don't think the update date will change if the skin has been on the site for less than 10 days.

this is true of the date, but the files weren't updating either.

If its less than the number of days (I think 10) it is treated as the origional.

I've updated files before where I found errors in my skin and I had to update it two days later. And the update date appeared. I've seen update dates appear the next day of the created date. Let's not make excuses if you don't know? So, what's going on? What's the problem, I'm not getting paid for this? So, why hurt my downloads? I think Shmoopy is right. There are some strange unfair things going on here.

MikeB314,
I know you've made windowblinds but, you probably never had to update until a new version of WB comes out. And like I said, I have skins where the update date is four days after the original upload date. For example, my Corona skin. I'm beginning to wonder if someone is having personal problems and taking it out on the skinners. If they don't like you personally, for some reason, they take it out on your work? Bloody Mozart!!

I thought you had to check a button "check for updates" or something. In doing that it will appear on the updated skins box...But how can it hurt your downloads? If you update your work, the download numbers stay intact I believe....

#7 by Mr ChasUGC - 5/27/2003 12:31:59 PM ...I'm beginning to wonder if someone is having personal problems and taking it out on the skinners.

There is absolutely no need for such an insult. Dumb and unneccessary. Do You know how much effort goes into keeping such a site as this going ? We know there was a server breakdown, so some things may still be wacky. Some people really get me upset and that is very hard with me...

BTW, I am beginning to wonder if skinning is all about download charts and being in the top ten lately...

There's no "hokey-pokey"  going on........... Jafo went through the same thing recently. He updated a WinAmp skin a few days after he uploaded, and it didn't appear in the Updated Skins list. T-Man informed him, skins updated within 10 days of the original upload, did not appear in the list.

Thank you for your support c242.............  I'm beginning to wonder the same thing too.

people run this site... machines run this site... they both make mistakes, it's not a big deal.

I can give two examples about how strange things are now....

I deleted the 'desktop' in my profile the other day and uploaded a different one. I tested it and knew it showed up. Then I checked it out a day later. The one I 'deleted' was there again. I thought maybe that 'they' didn't like my pic, but then I knew that they probably didn't even know I did that. The old pic should have been gone. I even cleaned out my cache and rebooted. I re-uploaded the one I changed to and it is fine.

Today, I changed the WC theme in the theme manager. It updated, but now every time I open a message, or refresh.. it is a different theme! HEH... I can live with that until it evens out..

Um, I am only trying to say it is easy to maybe jump to the wrong conclusion. But internet glitches happen all the time, and even seem to be happening now in more than one instance. I know the moderators here are good and caring people and I trust them. I also trust my knowledge that strange things happen sometimes and that if I wait a bit, I usually understand what happened.
[Message Edited]

There are still slitches from the server problems we were having.

However, the most likely cause for the date not changing is if you tried to update less than 10 days after it was originally published.  It has been this way for a very long time.

I think they are watching the never ending update situation. Seems there are a lot of updating with minor tweeks just to bring the work back to the front page. So my guess is that minor tweeks stay where they were and major tweeks get moved up. Just a guess.

EEK!

Chas, after I got a reasonable, logical explanation for what was going on here I felt fine (the worst thing for me was wondering if someone was somehow cheating my downloads for me which was even more upsetting than thinking I got purposely dissed by WC or something) which apparently (thank goodness) neither one of those things was true. I do understand how it feels sometimes when you're in the dark about something and you don't get a straight answer and your imagination takes over from there. After all, plenty of us here must have some pretty good imaginations to come up with the stuff we do so it goes without saying that that very imagination can also crop up in other places whether we want it to or not. I was more confused than suspicious but I was notably upset and I shoulda kept my cake-hole shut and just asked one of the Admins rather than taking it to the streets er…boards I mean.

Was Shmoopy right? Was Shmoopy wrong? Nope. Shmoopy was just confused over a lack of explanations as to what was going on behind the scenes to rectify the ‘injustices’ that perhaps have been going on here for a long time and WC was finally trying to find a way to stabilize the site and make it equitable for all artists concerned. No conspiracy theories, no purposeful unfairness but just people working behind the scenes here to try and make things a little more fair. There will be flaws in the updated system too and helpful input when bad patches show up will help everyone including the people here trying their best to make things better and fairer for everyone. If nobody mentions when things foul-up or glitch then how can things get better?

Oh, and Chas, I've had updates not show in the update section and I always chalked it up to the fact that the updates were rather swift (within days) and it would have seemed silly for the website to include my stuff in the updates section when it was still new anyway.

As far as it being viewed as so trifle and petty for people to be so ‘concerned’ about “Top Authors”, “Updates” or “Top Downloads” etc. might I remind those people that if it was no ‘biggy’ to EVERYONE here including WINCUSTOMIZE then WC wouldn’t be working to change the system in the first place to experiment and to make it more ‘fair’ for all. BUT, just as people find it unfair when people DO cheat and I’m sure it has been a real pain for WC to try and deal fairly with this sort of behavior from people…then we must also respect people who also have questions and concerns over fairness and that this is not because we’re greedy and petty and trifling but because we honestly want FAIRNESS just as most ANY human being does. I don’t think this is a grievous thing to want or need. Sure, I could have handled it in a much more rational way but I was so shocked that I handled it quite poorly (something I regret but have learned from).

Frankly, I don’t want art made by someone without emotions and feelings and likewise I don’t want to visit or even be a part of a website community that has no heart…and I think this site has heart and [I think] intrinsically it is in the right place but I don’t think that every person who gets a bit upset or feels the need to say something that is bothering them should instantly be pegged as a “melodrama queen” or the latest “whipping boy” unless the emotions and feelings expressed by that individual are observably false and put on only for an ‘end-effect’ which I don’t see many genuine members doing, and the emotional displays I have witnessed from time to time came from people/members whom were honestly upset and or feeling hurt over something they perceive as an injustice or a confusion etc. Kicking people when they are down does not resolve anything…it just adds further insult to injury…a reasonable explanation will heal a wound faster than 20 members doing a football tackle on one member for speaking on their own behalf over something they feel passionately about.

Now Chas, I'm in enough trouble over my 'poo-baby' thread so please...no using my name in thread headers without consulting with moi.

Life is what we make it and I'm makin' some brownies!

I’d give a group hug but with this Sars thing…

Adam Solley, Thank you for the explanation and I agree that your explanation is plausible. It is clear that there are server problems. You are a good caring soul, I can tell and I glad I associated with you in my sysmetrix skin. I'm sorry if it wasn't great enough but, I truly tried. It was hard to try to compliment a theme as great as Innovation. But, I tried.

C242, I really don't appreciate your comment. Your insinuations are insulting and a direct insult to my intelligence. I AM NOT DUMB. And, I won't brag about my intelligence level because of your comments. I did not accuse anyone of anything. My response was only suggestive and an attempt to get such people to realize how unfair such behavior is to others. If you took my comment personally, it seems that maybe you are one of those people with such a problem and it is on your conscience. And, your response suggests the same. As I heard someone say,"You need to check yourself".

Karma Girl and others,
I agree that it may be server problems. But, like I said, I have been updating skins within ten days and the update date always appeared. My sysmetrix Corona skin is an example(view the dates please). So, the ten day limitation isn't correct.

It seems these server problems are causing a lot of discomfort and problems for everyone. People can't download because it is broken, and skinners can't upload properly, update properly, and so on. And, people like C242 who want to jump on people and insult them directly doesn't help. It shows that my personal problem explanation was possible reason.

Also, I am not criticizing the work of the moderators as far as their efforts. It is obviously hard work to maintain a site such as this. And, I commend the moderators on their efforts. I do appreciate the ability to share work with others and the avenue that this site has offered to skinners. But, there is no compensation to the skinners. The only compensation that we get is to have our work shown and downloaded. It is the only way that we know if we are doing good work, when people download our skins. So, an accurate record is important to us. Stardock gets all the benefit monetary wise and I don't have a problem with that. They created Windowblinds and the programs. I just wish that others wouldn't jump on us when we show the problems with the site. And, the update error shows that there are still problems with the server. But, people like C242 have personal problems, and I have seen others with the same problems when they "jump on" people and directly insult others when they show such problems. I just hope that such a problem as C242's doesn't extend to the moderators. At this point I DON'T believe that they do.

Maybe there should be another way to present site problems so that personal attacks don't happen and so that no one feels personally attacked.

DON'T SHOT THE MESSENGER. We are in a critical time in this world with terrorism, online and abroad. If people get blamed or attacked when they come forth with information to protect others or explain problems, they won't come forth. If I get shot, that is fine, because I know that the only way to make things better are to come forth. Was I born to be a martyr? Maybe. Maybe not.

Shmoopy,
I apologize for using your name in the thread. But, it just felt the same to me. I didn't mean to include you in the possible backlash. I can take it myself. But, you too got a lot of backlash when you explained your problem and frustration with the system/server. And, I too got personal attacks/backlash when I sought to explain my problem and, I chose to address those who want to deal out backlash/personal insults. I didn't like the way they treated you and I was preparing for them. Let those people come forth and let the community say if it is appropiate to insult members when they want to address certain problems. Let the community decide if caring is the way or personal attacks are the way to address concerns. These people don't make it any easier sorting through the problems to fix them. In fact, it just builds frustration and anger for all involved.

Clearly, we have emotions in our work. If we were to leave out the emotions the work would suffer terribly. So, if there are problems, and because of the personal attacks which always seem to happen here, we are going to wonder if those people who continue to issue personal attacks are the ones behind the problems.

Those people need not comment. They are not helping anything or anyone. Of course their intention is to make others look bad. And, we feel it when we try to address the problems and we get naturally defensive when we get the personal attacks.

Maybe we need a server problem thread or some sort of site troubleshooting section. And maybe only those people who work with the server(I.E. Site Moderators) should comment. And, hopefully there would be no need for personal attacks or suggestions that they are treating others unfairly.

Shmoopy, its okay to hug me I don't have sars. lol.
Darn Emotions, we might do better without them. Well, maybe not.

(((BIG HUG TO SHMOOPY))}))

? Oh for goodness' sake, you drag terrorism and martyrdom into this because you publicly jumped to conclusions about someone screwing you out of your bleeping downloads and now yow wear a red nose? Please.

Look, if you have a question why not first find out what the heck is going on before engaging in public spectacle and speculation? (Same for those many others whose first move is to bleat publicly here about injustice when they haven't bothered to first try to ascertain the actual facts.)

Have a question about site operations? Email a site op, admin, mod, whatever and get an answer first rather than engage in unfounded public speculation and paranoia. Then if there really is something that should be brought to others' attention in a public manner, here's the venue and you'll have a case based on fact rather than paranoid hysteria. Better than pulling a Chicken Little.

Or do you really think it's better to just yell "fire" in a crowded theater because you think you saw someone flic a bic (or was it a small flashlight) when in fact no fire was actually set?

And maybe only those people who work with the server(I.E. Site Moderators) should comment.

I have a silly idea............... maybe you should write one of the admins, before you post a thread about how you're being mistreated. All you have to do is click the About link, and you have all our email addresses.
You have responses from 3 admins already, but you choose to ignore what we have told you. Updates within 10 days of original upload do not appear in the updated list. If you've had updates within that time frame that DID show up there, this was either before this practice was implemented, or that was a glitch.

ChasUGC...I'll correct one little error in your post and all this strangely will look like a load of inflamatory crap, intelligent or not.

So, the ten day limitation isn't correct.  [post #19]

This is a relatively recent response to the serial updater/s who abused the system to pathetically remain in the top authors' list as long as possible.

It's part of the implimentation that sees any and all 'updates' go through moderation where in the past Journeymen, etc could auto-bypass that.

Example?...when I was doing my Trapped In Bryceworld wall...it was [intentionally] updated often as it got worse and worse and remained on the new/recent list way longer than it really should.

Now? I do a winamp update a few days after upping the original and it goes into the 'waiting approval' queue and I gotta go in and approve it, but when I do it disappears off the recent list and doesn't show at all.  The system is NOW in place that a 'recent' update needs to be 10 days newer than its previous incarnation for it to show in that list as a new update.

I find the necessity for this damn annoying, particularly when my WA skin was a GENUINE and SIGNIFICANT update as it now supported a much later WA version, requiring additional skins to be created.  I also see the necessity for the restriction as I saw its abuse.....I mean, exactly how often do you need to update a wallpaper?....what...it has a bug and might crash your system?...

Dragging Shmoopy into a topic heading was a bit unfair, particularly if there is no connection with her original thread and this.

Conspiracy theories and immagination.....what fun we 'really' want to have....but sorry, there's nothing like that at all...just the silent whisper of black helicopters...

Sheesh what a can of worms. More attacks from people who have nothing positive to contribute.

If this is another recent change, then that is fine. I know that it worked differently a while ago. LOOK AT MY CORONA SKIN PLEASE. IT HAD UPDATES WITHIN FOUR DAYS AND THEY SHOW.

No one until now has even mentioned that there was a recent change.

First, I hear that they don't show if they are within ten days. Obviously, that isn't true because of my Corona skin. NO ONE MENTIONED THAT THIS WAS A RECENT CHANGE.

Then, I get a lot of personal attacks calling me Dumb, a Paranoid Hysteric and other things. I'm going to be better than that and not respond anymore.

If this is a recent change then again, that is fine. But, no one has said that. I only heard that there was a ten day limit and no one said it was recent.

And, to end this I'll just say forget it, okay? Do whatever you want to do to make this work the way it will benefit whoever you want. I still don't think its fair to constantly change things like this and get angry when no one knows about it.

If people want to update their skins so that they are better, why should anyone care that they get moved up a page or two. When, old windowblinds from two years get updated they go to the top of the pages. But, if a smaller skin gets updated within a few days, it is now limited? That is not fair. But, Whatever!! I'm out of this, do whatever you want. I'm tired of the personal attacks.

Also, I've apologized to Shmoopy so leave her out of it. I'm so tired of this. Point your black helicopters at me and do your will. That will teach people a lot about this site and the way it treats artists. I'm done submitting stuff to this site. I'm tired of the personal attacks. I'm tired of the people who submit no skins and slam other peoples work. I'm tired of people slamming others for having a different point of view. This isn't the type of community that I want to belong to, so have your fun with it. INSULT PEOPLE, RIP THEM APART, YOU DON"T HAVE TO THREATEN ME ANYMORE, I"M OUT OF HERE...(ChasUGC exits forever silent and non-creative)HAPPY??!! NO MORE COMPETITION FROM ME(PERIOD)