No suggestion of "hokey pokey" or adminstrative bias, just a problem that needed attention.

You are absolutely right. It is easy to fix if something went wrong without starting a war.

Thanks for that example. It shows how easy things like that can be solved.

MemberGone...what is your point?

MemberGone...is this work in the Newest additions display or the new updates list or what?

Provide a link to it and explain what it is about it that is a problem.

don't have a clue what it's about Paul but here's the link https://www.wincustomize.com/skins.asp?Library=3&skinid=2633

Ah for crying out loud!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I found it....the first date is the date of submission to the moderation list and the second date is the date it was approved.

Reason?...We deliberately want to cheat and manipulate innocent people.

No.

Reason?...because if the date of approval isn't set on release to the public and we had left it in moderation for a few days it would never be seen at all in the new additions list at all because the 2 dates would be both old....the date of the submission.

This was a change to make it fair for all, even those whose works were lying in limbo waiting for ages for approval.

Does this make sense to anyone out there?

 

Bloody paranoia....it's out to get you....

glad you figured it out 'cause it sure went over my head

/me thinks a Bloody paranoia makes for a messy message board

It’s EVER SO PLEASANT when the uninformed are only informed AFTER the fact. And “truth be told” if SOMEBODY doesn’t bring it to the board and all is “kept on the quiet” then NOBODY knows what is going on behind the scenes! Sometimes bringing it to the board ENLIGHTENS all who are also NOT INFORMED. Do you (admins) really want a thousand letters asking why this or that is not doing this or that? Nope, didn’t think so…which is WHY the board exist methinks…right?

AngEla’s 3 ways to avoid a major Snafu:

1). Inform people RIGHT away if you are messing with things that DO effect artists here in a VERY big way. You are TRYING to change things to HELP artists so since that is the case…please INFORM us so we don’t wax pathetic!
2). Expedient, honest responses are always apropos to ANY sitch but if you as an Admin or even the Site owner can’t explain something please don’t automatically jump down someone’s throat for bringing something up. Kindness and compassion will cool off the heels of even the most irate person versus bashing and gang-mentality. “Oh look at me…I’m jumping on the ‘gang-bang’ wagon to agree with everyone else…ain’t I important?!”
3). Just because changes are being made and YOU ARE IN THE KNOW (admins etc.) does not make us whom are NOT in the know…the ”mealy-mouthed-melodramatic-twits” without minds that often many people like to make us out to be. Logic and reason will quell irrational behavior faster than I can stop on a dime in a Ferrari. Squirrel around an issue without giving a logical answer will just cause much more confusion and questions and misunderstandings. I’d personally rather hear, “I’m sorry about the recent confusion you’ve been having but rest assured we are working on it and I apologize for any misconstrued interpretations you may have had by the lack of information I can give you at this time” rather than, “Your point is invalid, you suck…why are you whining…what is wrong with you? Some people spend a great deal of time dedicating their work and heart to this site…at least treat them with respect if they bring an issue to the board and are upset about it. Nothing, NOTHING is ever resolved by joking at the expense of opinion. Yes, I know…opinions are like a**holes…everyone has one but that doesn’t mean that we should invalidate those who dare to speak them.

Give me heat. Give me death…give me bad breath.


But give me liberty or give me...

Thanks, Jafo
I'm kinda glad that date thing was fixed for skins in moderation. My last wall was in moderation so long, when it was approved, it didn't even show up on the Newest Additions list. I thought it was my cookies or something but clearing them didn't help. I finally figured out it was just so far down when it came on board it had already dropped off the list. No harm, no foul, though.

I appreciate the work you guys do

Shmoopy...that is all well and good, but on the other hand, whenever something 'odd' or 'unexplained' crops up it is AUTOMATICALLY assumed that it is intentionally devious and sublime in intent and is specifically craft and corruption and favouring one person over another, rather than what it actually is - genuine improvements to the system and coding of the site.

Somehow the admins are forever being accused of conspiratorial acts of prejudice against one person or another.

As I said...'bloody paranoia' is out to get YOU.....

What say we try a brave new approach.  When the next 'new' thing happens, how about someone simply request 'is this a bug or a new feature?', if they are not already aware of it.

Let's not put it 'why is some guy getting his stuff up in the updates and mine isn't...you are obviously discriminating and nasty and rotten and I'm changing my name to 'buggered-off' cos I hate it/you all, and I will continue to poke and jab inanely till I look like a right idiot'.

Again, prior to all the changes to the 'updating of skins' system, big-name skinners, yes, those with direct upload access were abusing the system because there was no check in place. Now, ALL updates go through moderation [including the admins] as a check whereby it cannot be too frequent.

If the updated skin is less than 10 days from the previous update, or first upload, then it will still go through, but it will not show up in the 'updated skins' display on the list at right so it will not get unfair prominence/exposure above other more legitimate updates.

One problem [in the past, and now fixed] was if we inadvertently left a submission in the 'approval pending' admin area longer than a few days, while other works were being approved the upload [submission] date could be so old that the site coding would not recognise it on approval as a NEW submission and the work would end up so far down the list it would never show on the 'Newest Additions' list at right which was unfair loss of exposure for someone just because we may be unsure of its copyright or whatever and were waiting longer than usual.

Clearly fixing that means that the new handling method in the coding......making the 'update' date the date of approval, rather than the date of submission has meant a much fairer handling for all people's submissions, whether approved the day they are uploaded or approved weeks after uploading...BOTH make it into the 'new additions' list even though the latter has been lying dormant for a few weeks awaiting admin approval.

I hope this makes sense to someone....

pictoratus.....that's exactly why things had to change....people like yourself were being disadvantaged...

#27 any fears/concerns of discrimination
#63 cos I hate it/you all
#63 you are obviously discriminating

Did I mention any of these words? Hate & Discrimination?
I don't think so. Terrible-Nasty words. The two words that are the cause of all our major world problems.

Why couldn't some nice, caring administrator just say; Hey Guy/Girl, there was obviously a mistake. We are sorry if there was an misunderstanding.

Answer: No Problem, end of story.

Instead, there are insults, major hostility, jokes about intelligence, threats and accusations that this member is just another person complaining about discrimination and hatred. Or,(quote) "just another one of those kind of people." That is so cruel and sad.

Artists are giving their free time to make this an awesome site. Are we demanding pay for our free time? Nope. What are we asking? Maybe a little fairness and appreciation.

Instead, when an artist is hurt and concerned, they get:
(#29 sttroopers)
Then stfu lol. (Shut the f*** up) Well, lets check how many skins he has contributed. CHECK -> NADA/NOTHING

This is how artists are appreciated for the free time they spend to share their work with the uncontributing part of the community. Where is the kindness and maybe a little appreciation? Do we spend 30 hours working on a skin freely for this kind of treatment? NOT ME>

And where is the kindness and appreciation from the admins for the artists who are giving their free work? Do I spend 30 hours freely (per skin) for this kind of treatment. NOT ME>

All I see is a lot of bashing and slamming.

I guess we can't try to make the world a better place. When, one can't even get the admins on a website to understand and show caring for another artist who gives their time freely to make this the best skinning site on the net(in the world).(Note: I'm not speaking of my own work.)

But, if one looks at the world, one will see the same problem. A lack of caring and understanding. I guess its all just hopeless. Maybe we are all just hopeless. Maybe humanity is all just.....

I feel most sorry for our children. This is the kind of example we set for them. And we wonder why there are Columbines and 9/11's.(or total disrespect)

Some people will say, "now he's bringing Columbine and 9/11 into this"
Well, to those people I say,"Where do we start?"

That was an interesting thread. You first suggested bad practices by selecting the thread name. When several admins explained the situation the melodrame went on. Then you changed the nick and played the victim.

I am Dutch, so English is not my native language, but even I can understand the satire in parts of Jafo's last post.

Threads like these look like cheap soap operas.

ChasUGC....clearly you have difficulty understanding explanations posted here publicly on this board.

Might I suggest you/we continue this so clarity is restored...via email. martinp@smart.net.au

Obviously there is a communication breakdown...

/me stops dead in her tracks on the way to buy stocks in ti towels and rubber rooms..... if sanity prevails......

....by the way, if you poke on that email link and send off the email that opens (how convenient!) and include some thoughts and concerns from you, you really will find a human being on the other end who listens....
[Message Edited]

GM is lying about that....I'm actually one of those evil admins who are hell-bent on making life a misery for everyone.....ain't that right, Diane?...

> ...of course she's lying! ..But why would she lie? ...cause she's a fool? ...na, I can hardly believe that! She is here isn't she? then she must know what she is talking about! !!!/me thinks the WC site is a work in progress, as is almost everything in life, and it is no surprise to find some things confusing, or simply not working right. Therefore, given that everyone I know is only human, and therefore coders, administrators, skinners, posters.... everyone else is too, then I just am not going to spend that much energy trying to find fault! Most of the time, given some time things become clear to me. and if they don't I check them out by clicking on a link very similar to the one offered above. Of course, no one ever sees that, so my efforts are unknown, I remain relativly unknown (thank goodness). I don't do my best learning in public... therefore my act of being is not a shiny bright star. But I like to think it still shines. One thing I know for sure, click on any of the emails addresses for the admins, moderators, and most of the 'customers' here and you will find a human being.

heh

How'd you do that?

Never mind....I'll never understand this HTML stuff...

...it's that intense guy that did it... >

#65  by  MemberGone - 5/31/2003 1:42:41 AM Why couldn't some nice, caring administrator just say; Hey Guy/Girl, there was obviously a mistake. We are sorry if there was an misunderstanding. Answer: No Problem, end of story. Instead, there are insults, major hostility, jokes about intelligence, threats and accusations that this member is just another person complaining about discrimination and hatred. Or,(quote) "just another one of those kind of people." That is so cruel and sad. I thought that I covered all of what you said in my post: #44 by Admin KarmaGirl - 5/28/2003 7:01:45 AM The other idea is that there *might* actually be a bug in the code and it is not resetting dates for whatever reason. (gasp!...horror!) I think the T-Man is looking at it to make sure of it. It could also be human error. (I know...that's not allowed). An admin can uncheck the reset date if they think it is being abused, which also means that they can accidentally hit that box. My question is. (And this is a general question) Why aren't these types of issues sent to the admins as a question before they are posted to the public forum? If they were emailed, then we could look into the issue and fix it if need be after appropriate info has been obtained. When it is posted publicly, it opens a whole can of worms involving a whole bunch of people who ultimately get mad at each other. KarmaGirl sits down to get her complimentary temple rub...... Everything that I posted there was the truth.  Here are the cliff notes version for short attention spans: could be a bug- T-man is looking into it.  Could be human error since admins can change dates.  If stuff like this happens- contact an admin so that it can be fixed without a flame war happening. I see nothing in my post that shouldn't have explained the situation. This board is in constant changes.  We are always improving it (which I assume people want).  If you find something that looks wrong, email an admin and we can look into it.

#23  by Wizop Koasati - 5/27/2003 4:06:34 PM I have a silly idea............... maybe you should write one of the admins, before you post a thread about how you're being mistreated. All you have to do is click the About link, and you'll have all our email addresses

We really will try to help, when confronted in a civil manner..............

happy happy happy

I have noticed a severe shortcoming due to the nature of the message board, and, that is how difficult if not impossible our tones of voice are to convey.
Unlike a telephone where inflections can be discerned, the message board can only provide the sender and the reader a "shorthand", condensed version of what we are needing to say and how we are trying to say it.
When someone becomes frustrated with a problem, the answer to a question here can be misread all too easily according to the mood of the reader.
Then there are those who have a "shortness" and perhaps "defensive" attitude that only enhances this unique problem, and some simply enjoy "stirring the pot" in order to "prove" themselves in a childish manner.
Several things are needed here:
1- When responding to a question, let's take time to understand what is being said by reading and thinking, not trying to be the first to respond for it's own sake. I for one despise being led to water like a horse on a tether, only to discover the leader didn't know where they were going and only hoped to find it.
2- When responding to a question, put yourself in the shoes of the other. Though you may have the latest and greatest equipment, not everyone else does nor can afford to. Please don't tell me I need this software or that hardware to do what I have already been doing.
3- Remember, no matter how smart you think you are - your not.
4- People have feelings and those feelings cannot be trampled over because you are in another part of the world hiding, such action to me is called cowardliness.
5- It is always easier to find fault than to find solutions, let us all work harder, and together.
6- Artists are a creative people filled with emotion and ideas trying hard to express themselves. Let us as Artists respect and understand we have freedom to express ourselves, and a unique place to show it here at Wincustomize.

I am also finding those who are using the new "Quote" feature provided on this board are doing so in order to "provoke" if not "attack" others. I have seen children do this very thing, it's called "Tattleling" It also allows comments to be taken out of context and used against another.

Plus, the html use by the admins ect may be cute, but I find it offensive. When it is used, this tells me that I am regarded as second class in the Wincustomize community on the Wincustomize community board because I am unable to use it.
Just a few more things to think about, otherwise I see Wincustomize becoming just like "all the rest", and therefore not deserving of my continued support.