So whats so special about Arcane Towers and Lost Library's now?(1.09n Beta)

from Elemental Forums

Hi Guys and Gals.

So as the title suggest the new changes have creates some FANTASTIC things but it kinda makes arcane towers and Lost library's a wash.

Both Lost Libs and Arcane towers give +5 to there respected resource and take up 4 squares tiles + take 10 pop to sustain.   If I wanted to specialize a city to be arcane (as the image below represents) I really dont need to grab any arcane towers.  I can simply spam building mini arcane towers.  They produce + 1 arcane and take 1 square + 5 Pop.  So do we really want to hunt down arcane towers and libs for +1 more research point and - 1 tile footprint? 

You might argue that the savings in population is the trade off.  Well not really its only cost 25 pop for 5 buildings instead of 10 pop for the one 4 tile footprint arcane tower.  As you can see below the 4 huts provide WELL more than enough for this city to continue building smaller towers.

In this case I don't know if trying to search out these rare resources is worth the trouble and the turns.  The only real resources that we want are Mines/Gold and metal, crystals, and food. (and shards of cores).

Now can I propose a reversal to how it was before the beta patch.  What if Towers and Lost libs provided a % boost to buildings.  The way buildings used to provide the % boost before the beta patch.  Its seems best to just massively spam research buildings if i have the food currently.

I don't want to provide an AI idea what to do in a case like I have stated above because this is a beta.  We would have to see which way it goes.

Thoughts?

 

elemental
8,361 views 17 replies
Reply #1 from Stardock Forums Top

In the case of Lost Libraries, they might give a +X% chance of a given research being availible. Not sure about Arcane Temples.

Reply #2 from Elemental Forums Top

Intelligent Post Shark!  You make a strong case...  Hope the powers that be will hear...

Galactic Civilizations III
Reply #3 from Elemental Forums Top

I made a similar comment in another thread. There's no special feeling attached to finding those resources now that you probably have hundreds of studies/arcane labs running in your cities. It used to be - "WOW, that's a huge bonus and I can really take advantage of that". Now it's - "meh, yay, I suppose".

Reply #4 from Elemental Forums Top

yeah they gotta fix this. Until they do build baby build!

Reply #5 from Elemental Forums Top

I thought all the resource nodes were % multipliers? shows how much i've been paying attention.

 

Yea now that you mention it, I think gold mines would fall into this category of underwhelming as well (although besides spamming pop, i don't think there are +gilder buildings besides a % multiplier).

Reply #6 from Elemental Forums Top

Don't the mini-arcane labs cost 1 gold per turn in maintenance?

That put the arcane towers about as good as the gold mines, as they save you 5 gold per turns in maintenance, which is what the gold mine would produce (before counting any % bonuses). So an arcane tower is more or less equal to a gold mine + 5 arcane labs.

Reply #7 from Elemental Forums Top

Yes, the small buildings do cost maintenance - which adds up massively if you're spamming the small buildings.  There's an additional problem though: population isn't a meaningful restriction.  The (basically free) Beacon of Hope in your capital will completely fulfill your population needs for most of the game, as long as you can build housing to keep it cranking out people.  The stats definitely need tweaking on population in order to make it scarcer.  Perhaps reducing the Beacon of Hope bonus would help.

Reply #8 from Elemental Forums Top

Perhaps allow lost libraries, temples to allow access to specific lines of research that aren't available with the mini research labs?

Reply #9 from Elemental Forums Top

Quoting ElanaAhova, reply 8
Perhaps allow lost libraries, temples to allow access to specific lines of research that aren't available with the mini research labs?
End of ElanaAhova's quote

 

Or, make the Temples and Libraries more rare.  When you run across one, it either boosts your research percentage by a goodly amount, or once built, it provides a free, random technological breakthrough/Arcane Spell.

Reply #10 from Elemental Forums Top

I don't think it's possible to make them more rare. Any more rare and they'd be mythological.

Reply #11 from Elemental Forums Top

Here's an idea: Re-use the creativity trait

 

Arcane Libraries- each one gives a chance of discovering your next spell instantly

Lost Libraries- does this for regular research.

More libraries= more chance.

Gold mines providing more gold- they work as is to me, maybe buff them slightly

 

This would be in addition to current benefits for each library.

 

Reply #12 from Elemental Forums Top

Why not just put a 3 building limit on all improvements so we don't see spamming?

Reply #13 from Stardock Forums Top

Quoting seanw3, reply 12
Why not just put a 3 building limit on all improvements so we don't see spamming?
End of seanw3's quote

Because then people will spam cities to amass enough of those buildings.

Reply #14 from Elemental Forums Top

I think the solution would be:

Arcane Laboratory +1 arcane research -1 gold

Arcane Temple +5 base +50% to all Labs arcane research

eg I have 10 Arcane Labs and 1 Arcane temple.

So I get 10 base (Labs) +5(Temple) +5(Bonus from %) = 20 total

 

If I just have:

1) 10 Labs = 10 research

2) 0 Labs + 1 Temple = 5 research

3) 2 Labs + 1 Temple = 2 + 1 + 5 = 8 Research

 

Gives a nice incentive to get them Arcane Temples.  Same for the Study/Lost Library combo.

Reply #15 from Elemental Forums Top

Quoting Althaer, reply 9

Or, make the Temples and Libraries more rare.
End of Althaer's quote
More? Libraries are (almost) as rare as horses right now.

Quoting seanw3, reply 12
Why not just put a 3 building limit on all improvements so we don't see spamming?
End of seanw3's quote
Haven't we been there already?

Reply #16 from Elemental Forums Top

Quoting Heavenfall, reply 10
I don't think it's possible to make them more rare. Any more rare and they'd be mythological.
End of Heavenfall's quote

Like horses?

Reply #17 from Elemental Forums Top

The 15 population trade off is 15 troops you could be recruiting, or three more buildings you could have. I'd agree they need to do more though, I'd either double the boost or remove the population cost altogether.