Why am I not permitted to rate skins that I port?

from WinCustomize Forums
Today I received an email saying

Thank you for your recent upload of your CP38 BeatNik for Beatnik.
Just a heads up.....collaborative efforts preclude you from rating your
partner's works.....it's the equivalent of rating your own, and therefore cheating.
I have removed any that I have noticed to date...and will continue to watch
these submissions.

Truth be told, he is NOT my partner. Though I have made several ports of his skins! I don't make the WindowBlinds, Rainlendars, Sysmetrix....etc. I don't make any of the images he uses....As a matter of fact he make ALL the images I use....I even request specific images when I need them. He sends me .psd files....I don't send him any...so how does this make my PORTS any different from anyone elses' ports?

So, if they are going to remove the ratings to the skins of Pinchecl's that I PORT then they should remove the ratings of the skins other people port....

I made a ports of Obdisian Order and rated it, Marcintesh OS-W, Outlook RB, K-Tek Steel, and several others too....then any ratings I gave them should be removed. Also, I know that some of those authors rated my skins, so you should fix that too. And while you're at it, you should remove any ratings they did on any other ports of their work! Oh, and as long as your so worried about it, also remove the ratings of the person that ported the skin, because I'm sure they rated the original too

First I'm not permitted to upload a Suite file that contained some of Pinchecl's skins in the suite file itself..instead of being linked...ok fine even though I have permission from him to do so, but now I can't rate his work, because he's my partner....Ok...IF he's my partner, then I own half of his work....which I do NOT, and should be permitted to upload the Suite files.....I mean it's at least half mine right?

Does that make me partners with CaveBear too? I've ported Lila, and Dream Rain and am in the process of doing more Dream Rain skins as well as Blue Lagoon??

Please, help me understand this....
And let me make it clear, that I only port Pinchecl's skins....
He really makes ALL the skins himself...
I do other ports while I'm waiting on a new set from him....I don't actually help him make the skins in any way....My contributions to HIS skins...when he's doing a new set is strictly testing and suggesting...I know that plenty of author's have people they always use to test, right?? Well, I can honestly say that until PINCHECL makes the skin and sends it to me to test I have no hand in making them....and several times I have to download the skins from here to get them....

And while I would love to actually have the artistic ability to make images and skins from scratch, I don't....that's why MOST of my skins are PORTS. Pinchecl's included. I have always said that he was the artist....and that I have NOTHING to do with the most important part of making the skins...
21,026 views 61 replies
Reply #1 from WinCustomize Forums Top
Now this is scary. Terrible logic on behalf of the WC mods. It is wrong! TN Brat, you should be able to rate anything you didnt make. I have to shut up now before I get myself into trouble. >
Reply #2 from WinCustomize Forums Top
Thanks NightTrain!

Oh, and I want to add, that while this Mod took the time ti send me this notice...the skin in mentioned in the email....CP39 For Beatnik....is STILL Waiting On Approval!
[Message Edited]
Ashes of the Singularity II
Reply #3 from WinCustomize Forums Top

Have you considered privately discussing this with the admin who emailed you this instead of posting it online where nobody can do anything but start giving an opinion?

If you port a skin, then giving it a high rating (the original) is a bit of a bias.  That is what we are attempting to avoid.  However, it is not policy to keep you from rating any skins made by a particular author.

Please discuss this in private with the admin who emailed you.

Reply #4 from WinCustomize Forums Top
I believe that opinions are important.

We are the customers after all.

And it's a simple matter of democracy.

Sorry, though that you feel that I shouldn't discuss this here.
Reply #5 from WinCustomize Forums Top

TN Brat, you must make up your mind. In previous communications you said that pinchecl and you were working together, and that was your excuse for uploading his stuff under your name.  And now you are saying that you are not?

Anyway, please continue this conversation by email.

Reply #6 from WinCustomize Forums Top
We are working together. Obviously, I make ports of ALL his skins. Just as I make ports of several other author's skins.

Does that maen I am partners with any author I port?

Should porting a skin stop me from rating it?

I've never ever claimed that I made any of the images...Or have I tried to take credit for them. The file I wanted to upload in my name were only Suite files...and in those I say that all images belong to Pinchecl.I stand by tha statement that I am working with Pinchecl....and I am thankful that he included me when making a set, but the point it I am not a "partner" with him...He retains ALL the rights to all the skins....I've gone as far as saying that he holds the rights to any of my ports too. After all it's ALL his work.

As for the prior communications, yes I said we were working together....anyone can see that. He gave me specific permission to upload the skins you are refering to....the Suite files, but you guys rejected them, because they were not my work....

So, it's you guys that should make up your mind. I am only going by what happened before...if I have no right to upload the Suite, by your guidelines, then I am NOT partnered with Pinchecl and therefore should be permitted to rate his skins.

I don't see why this can't be discussed here...I'm not taking shots at anyone...I am questioning a policy....but if you want me to stop repling, then stop taking shots at me, causing me to defend myself.
[Message Edited]
Reply #7 from WinCustomize Forums Top
First tN Brat is not allowed to upload suites which contains parts or all of my work because its not entirely hers', now this. What in heavens name is going on here? If it is a rule, fine. But why do I see several suites appear no different from the one she wanted to upload. And does that mean the lot of us can expect an email with the same message? >
Reply #8 from WinCustomize Forums Top
So, if you really like a skin, so much that you want to port it over to another program that you like, you are no longer able to rate it. I guess that means that if you feel a skin is a 10, you shouldn't rate it because you might port it. So, listen up people, only use skins that are eight or below. That means download all of mine!!!
Reply #9 from WinCustomize Forums Top
Also, no one give me a ten on any of my skins and if you do please don't port them. I need all the tens I can get.
Reply #10 from WinCustomize Forums Top
....funny!! Ok, then can I port Just Push Play...it's one of my favs anyway...though I think I already rated it?

The thing is for me that I don't always rate skins I port with a 10...not at all actually.

I don't even rate all of Pinchecl's skins with a 10 either....sorry Cliff. But just like with anyone elses skins... some I like, some I don't and some are middle of the road for me, to be honest.

And not all the skins that I rate high do I ask to port....

Ok, so I'm off to rate yours now....hold on....
Reply #11 from WinCustomize Forums Top
Democracy ? Wassat ?
Reply #12 from WinCustomize Forums Top
Here's my two cents....even if these two jamokes are in like Flynn and poppin' off Nadia's to each other....it's only one rating, in a hill of ratings and that boney chickenwing has little meat all by it's lonesome. Especially if the proposed weighted ratings are in place....back to lurk-mode
Reply #13 from WinCustomize Forums Top
....funny!! Ok, then can I port Just Push Play...it's one of my favs anyway...though I think I already rated it?


Yes.., hmm?, well.., uh, great.., umm..,thank you? Well, it was nice for me anyway.

Oh, I get it! Maybe we need to sign a non-partnership agreement.
Reply #14 from WinCustomize Forums Top
Good point! ..though are you insulting me??? Only kidding....seriously good point!

On may occasions, not just with Pinchecl's skins, but today with Niko's newest WB, I rated it high, but it didn't effet the current rating one bit...

Chas UGC, well it's either I rate you high or I get to port your skin...it's up to you...lol Unless of course you draw up the agreement.
[Message Edited]
Reply #15 from WinCustomize Forums Top
TN Brat...no insult...just support
Reply #16 from WinCustomize Forums Top
Does this mean that the rating system is now retroactive? So that if anyone ports a skin, or later becomes a partner with someone else that all previous ratings regarding this person and the other will be removed? Will, this be a global rule or just one to use if you don't like one person or the other? If it is global, it has to be fair then, but seems like a whole lot of work. If it is not global, then that is totally unfair, and I just want to say that I love all the admins.
Reply #17 from WinCustomize Forums Top
Non Partnership Agreement

The former, known as TN Brat!, and the latter, known as ChasUGC, do not know each other. We met in cyberchat last week but that was in mind only. We do not engage in any profit from this project, and therefore we could care a hill of beans, what anyone thinks about our work. Therefore, all negative comments will be ignored.

We, in non partnership, futhermore, think that it sucks that anyone would remove our little rating just because we liked each others work enough to port it to make it a wee bit more popular. Maybe it is just jealousy from all the money that we aren't making in our non-partnership. So, screw you.

Signed___________
Signed___________
[Message Edited]
Reply #18 from WinCustomize Forums Top
Yes, I know Essencay...And it really means a LOT to me!!!!


And Chas....ok now I'm confused...lol But that's an interesting question....considering that the email said that he has removed all thst he's noticed to date....hmmmm so it IS going to be retroactive???
Reply #20 from WinCustomize Forums Top
Yep, that means all Skinplant ratings and Pixtudio ratings, from anyone in partnership throughout time must now be removed. It doesn't matter whether you ported any work from the other, but now they are in partnership and all ratings from one or the other, throughout time, must be removed to keep it fair. So if Hippy, ever rated Mikes work, it must be removed for fairness. Wait a minute, does this mean a non-profit partnership or a profit sharing partnership? Maybe its time for another agreement, agree?
[Message Edited]
Reply #21 from WinCustomize Forums Top
ChasUGC....methinks you are taking this thing too far
Reply #22 from WinCustomize Forums Top

There is an ethical reason behind this.  If you port a skin, you have a personal interest in the original being popular so that your port will also be popular. 

On may occasions, not just with Pinchecl's skins, but today with Niko's newest WB, I rated it high, but it didn't effet the current rating one bit...

It's an average, so your rating might not change the rating.

Reply #23 from WinCustomize Forums Top
Or maybe a Non-profit non-partnership vs. Profit sharing Partnership

Wait a minute here. Mormegil works for Stardock, and Wincustomize is affiliated with Stardock. Therefore, the admins can't rate Mormegil, because of bias. Therefore, for fairness, all ratings for Mormegil's work, by admins, should be removed. Come-on this has to be fair, right?
Reply #24 from WinCustomize Forums Top
I'm not smart enought o get the quote thing working....or just a little to frustrated to think....but consider it signed....

I've got another problem now....
Earlier, before I got the email, I rated Niko's CyberSkin WB rather high....then I sent over to DA and sent him a note offerint to make the Tabs and Beatnik for this skin, if he waan't going to do them himself....

So, now what? Do I with draw my offer/request for the ports...
Or, do I contact a Mod and ask them to remove my rating....
At least until Nikos says Yes or No about the ports....
Then if it's a no I they can put my rating back and if it's a yes, then I'll have to apologize to Nikos for porting his skin...and droping his rating...

KarmaGirl,
I understand the ethical part, I do. But like you said...
"It's an average, so your rating might not change the rating."
Then where's the harm in rating any skin that I port?

Lila & Blue Lagoon each when they came out...I had no idea then that I was going to port them, so are those ratings going to be removed because I did?

I think it may have a neg effect on porting in general....because in the end, authors won't grant permissions to people with the power to rate, because that'll take away from their ratings...

[Message Edited]
Reply #25 from WinCustomize Forums Top
I'm just trying to get everyone to see how silly all this is sounding. It is a silly little rating that means nada in the world scheme. And, it's influence is minimal as KarmaGirl says herself. Can we forget this attempt to minimize artist involvements with each others work and move on?