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My rant about uxtheme patching and msstyles

My rant about uxtheme patching and msstyles

I'm in a ranting mood today. So I'm going to talk about the whole msstyles, uxtheme, thing on Windows XP.  Now this rant is not aimed at people who choose to make msstyles. I have a very high opinion of anyone who takes time to share with the world anything they create regardless of whether it's for Litestep, msstyles, Hoverdesk, or of course our stuff.

Windows XP comes with its own "visual style engine". That's how you get the blue, silver, and green "styles". But that's all there are. That's because the interface to change them, uxtheme.dll will only use Microsoft digitally signed msstyles (the file that contains the "visual style").  So if you want more, you've got two choices: 1) You can make your own format and apply them (which is what WindowBlinds does) or 2) You can try to crack the security out so that you can use unsigned msstyles.

This is a bit of a sore point for me as a software developer because certain..companies have made it out that they are actually skinning Windows when in fact all they've done is crack the security built into uxtheme.dll.  Hey, if you want to mess with your system DLLs then it's your system, go for it. But what really rips me is how companies try to make it out like patching uxtheme.dll is somehow a safe and easy thing. It is if you're reasonably technical. But those who advocate that don't tend to show up when a new Windows XP service pack shows up and the system won't boot or their title bars are all missing or whatever.  The same company doing this stuff is planning on adding support to change the "boot screen".  I somehow doubt they'll make it clear that to change the boot screen you have to patch the actual Windows kernel (which is why we don't mess with that).  Similarly, those patching uxtheme are stuck having to replace their shellstyles.dll. There are whole websites now that allow people to essentially distribute copyrighted parts of the Windows OS without a) any regard to the piracy issues and b) without recognizing that when you replace the actual code binaries, bad things may happen in the future. 

That said, I have nothing against people patching uxtheme.dll to apply their own hacked msstyles (there's no such thing as a pure .msstyles file -- they are actually a .DLL renamed with graphics resources inside which means, amongst other things, it's a dead end -- come Longhorn, .msstyles go bye bye).  I just wish its proponents (as well as companies that make a profit off of cracking Microsoft's digital signing security) would be up front about what they do instead of passing what they're doing A) as "their" work and B) Stop making it out like patching out system DLL security is somehow a "native" way of getting more visual styles. To me native doesn't include the words "patching" and "system files" in the same sentence.

And patching uxtheme certainly doesn't add features. It just means you can, basically, replace the bitmaps of the Windows XP blue, silver, green, msstyle.  This is probably why when Microsoft wants to add more visual styles for a promotion like with the Xbox or Age of Mythology it's WindowBlinds they use as well as what they recommend to OEMs. WindowBlinds doesn't hack the system. What really galls me is the idea that someone would charge the unwary for the patch. It would be like charging money for a program that changes wallpaper because users didn't know where the wallpaper changing dialog was.  I probably wouldn't have such a hard time with the charging of such patching if there was some value-add.

So that's my two cents on that subject. Incidentally, *I* do have my uxtheme patched because I use both WindowBlinds visual styles and msstyles. I certainly didn't pay to do it, I did it myself with a hex editor. But I've been digging into OS internals for over a decade and I don't freak out if my system doesn't boot up. I know how to get back to a command line and mess around with system restore if need be.  But that's the thing, I know what I'm getting myself into. I suspect most normal people with lives who are interested in customizing their PCs just want to download a program that will work well. Not one that may or may not work on the next service pack.

The only other sore point about msstyles is their relentless advocates. People who would, if they could, wreck skinning for the long term because they hate the idea of someone making money on customizing.  Hey, if you want to use msstyles, go for it. It's your PC. But don't go on some web forum and tell people it's somehow better than WindowBlinds because, sorry, that's ridiculous. Besides being relativley primitive in features, msstyles are slower, use more RAM, are larger to download, don't fully skin existing programs, and have only a fraction of the # of visual styles that are available for WindowBlinds. Oh and did I mention they're doomed after XP?

That isn't to say WindowBlinds is perfect. But it is to Photoshop what msstyles are to MS Paint. MS Paint is not a bad start but don't try to argue that it's better than Photoshop. Oh, and in this analogy, Photoshop uses less RAM than MS Paint.

These days the more vocal msstyles zealots will try to say "Well, all the WindowBlinds skins are bloated and ugly.." which means, of course, that they didn't really bother to look. If you scan the net for msstyles, you'll find that they are typically just like Windows XP except now a different hue. Maybe they're purplish.  Of course, you can do this with WindowBlinds without having to find a new visual style since WindowBlinds can change the color of a skin on the fly. That doesn't mean there aren't great msstyles floating around on the net -- there are (of course, SkinStudio can convert them to WindowBlinds since WindowBlinds is a superset of features but I digress). 

But the thing is, WindowBlinds has been around for 5 or so years now, its community has moved way beyond the initial hacker demographic that the msstyles user base is at (and likely to stay at since, like I said, it does require you to crack system DLLs to use which ain't for the average user).  So the styles and tastes are all over the place now. But yea, it too for the first couple of years mainly fixated on those minimalist "Look, it's like KDE!" skins.

22,508 views 74 replies
Reply #51 Top
All I was saying is that everything to me looks ok using StyleXP, I don't give a hoot if the shutdown/logoff box looks like luna blue. I have used both , I just prefer StyleXP, not knocking WB at all. I have used WB, just because there are many awesome themes for it, but I use StyleXP for the same reason, I just like it better, is that so wrong? No. I don't think so.
Reply #52 Top

No 75 (And others).

Style XP doesn't skin.

On your system is a DLL called uxtheme.dll.  IT skins much of Windows. It is what does 100% of the work.

But Microsoft didn't want other people to make msstyles. So they made it so that only Microsoft msstyles would work.

Style XP cracks that uxtheme.dll so that any.msstyles file will work. There's a free patch that does the same thing.

Now, why do people get so up in arms about this distinction?

Well, imagine you were a game developer and some company sold a program that cracked the CD copy protection for say The Sims.  How do you think other game developers would feel if the company that sold this crack implied that THEY had actually written The Sims?

EA makes the game, The Sims. Not the people who crack the copy protection.

By the same token, Microsoft is the one who wrote 100% of the XP skinning that you see when you use a crack like Style XP or uxtheme patcher.

That's why there is so much hostility towards TGT Soft on the net. A) They've implied that they do something they don't -- i.e. take credit for other people's work and B) They charge for it!

 

Reply #53 Top
Hello? Microsoft did the same thing with both Media Player 9 AND Internet Explorer it seems......
Reply #54 Top
That's why there is so much hostility towards TGT Soft on the net. A) They've implied that they do something they don't -- i.e. take credit for other people's work and B) They charge for it!



So why has Microsoft done nothing about this? I know they may have bigger fish to fry, but that is a company with a pretty popular website with their apps hosted on Download.com? How do they get away with it?
Reply #55 Top

No 75 -- Microsoft WROTE Media Player 9 and IE and represent substantial effort.

I can't speak for MS but I suspect the reason they haven't gone after them (so far) is PR. Because they'd also need to go after all the sites that carry .msstyles, .logonui's, and shellstyle.dll's too. And these things aren't costing Microsoft money or anything so there's not a lot of incentive to go after them.

Reply #56 Top

Hus...my guess would be that the next version of Windows will put an end to its functioning anyway....and [Microsoft] they have the lateral thinking that anyone who has hacked a resource file may be in violation of the EULA but at the same time doing so absolves Microsoft from any and all responsibilities regarding customer service, complaints, warranties, etc.....since the 'contract' is void, being broken in law by the hacker and the person applying it.

Ultimately, styleXP users may be open to prosecution for interfering with the Microsoft product, but in reality they are simply foolish and misguided...

Reply #57 Top
Because they'd also need to go after all the sites that carry .msstyles, .logonui's, and shellstyle.dll's too.


I don't find that as a good reason. That's like trying to stop warez, it's almost impossible. I bet there are more people using StyleXP rather than a home-made uxtheme patch, right? So why not take out the biggest fish in the sea and let the guppies live? If I wanted to, hypothetically speaking, stop Stardock from making Windowblinds, I'm not gonna go after DA for hosting WB skins, I'm gonna go straight to the source. So, if you take away TGTSoft, which in turn will take away ThemeXP.org, which in turn will cut out most of the .msstyle users. The only ones left will be knowledgeable hacker teens who know where to go for this kind of stuff. Isn't that good enough for MS? If you take away the majority, who cares about the minority?
Reply #58 Top
I think it's mostly the fact that TGTSoft represents no real threat monetarily.



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Reply #59 Top
I suspect more people are using the free cracked .dll than have actually paid for StyleXP. I frequently see links to the cracked .dll on perfectly above board (ie, not warez) sites that would NEVER allow a post linking to any cracked software programs. People just do not give it any thought, even those who would not use warez. All they know that the crack is free and why pay for an unnecessary program when you can get the job done for free?



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Reply #60 Top
Sig, your post is bit hypocritical (no offense). First you say more people use the uxtheme patch than StyleXP software, then say the patch is posted in sites that frown upon warez, then you say "All they know that the crack is free and why pay for an unnecessary program when you can get the job done for free?" Isn't that last statement considered using warez? Yes, it's very true...but warez none-the-less.

Anyway, I highly doubt more people use the crack rather than StyleXP software. You figure the majority of the web aren't very efficient in computers yet. They still need the simple point-n-click interface. My mom uses computers at work ALLLL day long, and I had to ask her to replace her uxtheme.dll, should would look at me like I've got 4 heads. Also, the #1 place for Visual Styles (themeXP) is owned/hosted/run by TGTSoft, which inturn lures all those first-time visitors to StyleXP. They might not have bought the software, but I'm sure most of them use the trial versions. Anyway, I don't even know why I'm arguing this...I don't even use StyleXP! I'm just in a mood...I dunno...
Reply #61 Top
I think you people don't like StyleXP because its taking money away from Stardock perhaps? Hmmmmm......just a thought.
Reply #62 Top
No...people don't like styleXP because it's wrongly mis-represented as a skinning program....and it's skinning capabilities are limited and therefore inferior to WB.....just a fact....
Reply #63 Top
Sig, your post is bit hypocritical (no offense). First you say more people use the uxtheme patch than StyleXP software, then say the patch is posted in sites that frown upon warez, then you say "All they know that the crack is free and why pay for an unnecessary program when you can get the job done for free?" Isn't that last statement considered using warez? Yes, it's very true...but warez none-the-less.


Hus, is English your second language? I am not being sarcastic, simply wondering because you seem to have attributed a view to me that is not my own or seem to think I am unaware of precisely what I intended to say.

My "post" is not "hypocritical." Perhaps it's either a matter of language or you didn't appreciate that I specifically intended to point out this irony: some of those people who use the cracked proprietary file without a second thought at the same time shun warez with distaste; respected forums allow the posting of links to the cracked file while at the same time removing links to crracked programs. That is precisely my point: they do not recognize that in effect the cracked .dll is a kind of copyright infringement/warez. That's the irony since for these people and forums it's an unconscious form of hypocrisy.

Oh and by the way, the distribution and use of the cracked .dll is a violation of MS' copyright since it is a proprietary MS file. Since that is the case, StyleXP is in violation of MS copyright also. See....the ironies abound.



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Reply #64 Top
Sig, after re-reading your post, I want to say you're right. It's a misunderstanding, I wasn't thinking clearly at that moment in time, I just read your post the wrong way. Sorry 'bout that...
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Reply #65 Top
Hus....I figured you had done that....
Reply #66 Top
I'm really starting to think a video has to be made to show No.75 what StyleXP trully is O_o

Or look at a fresh install of WinXP with the 3 Luna's, you DONT NEED StyleXP to use it because its uxtheme/msstyles that runs it.
Reply #67 Top
Most people use uxtheme.dll I suspect. 
Reply #68 Top
I rest my case.

http://www.themexp.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=6702

Reply #69 Top

The language in those posts is a clear indicator of the maturity and intelligence of the opinion holder which bodes ill for their credibility. Strangely [or perhaps not] those who commented there in support of WB appear to be more reasoned and eloquent, irrespective of anyone's preference for siding with one or the other...

If anyone wants their opinion to be taken seriously it is imperative that they refrain from childishly immature and facile language and argument.

You don't have to be a rocket scientist to hold an opinion worthy of respect....but it sure helps if you conduct yourself like one...

Reply #70 Top
I think you people don't like StyleXP because its taking money away from Stardock perhaps? Hmmmmm......just a thought.




that cracks me up...

Makes me wonder if one *thinks* that sheetrock screws are just as good as ring shank nails when you've a Hammer in your hand...


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Reply #71 Top

I think you people don't like StyleXP because its taking money away from Stardock perhaps? Hmmmmm......just a thought.

Actually, you'd be surprised. Style XP actually BRINGS new Windowblinds customers. There are a lot of people who found out about changing their XP skins with Style XP, then afterwards heard of Windowblinds, so they tried it. They found that Windowblinds is faster, and has more nicer skins, so they bough it.

I'm not inventing things. It happens a lot. 

Reply #72 Top
Funny how "things happen"
Reply #73 Top
Why is it the 1337 teens think they know more about computers than everyone else and have to cuss out at everyone that disagrees with them? Seeing that the Style XP user base tends to be teens that can't spell and that the Windowblinds user base tends to be of higher intellect and belong to all age groups, I really feel I made the best choice sticking with Windowblinds.


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Reply #74 Top
Not sure about 'higher intellect'...but certainly higher standard of education...