Anyone else find this game damn near impossible?

I'm playing on normal in a 4player map, and all 3 gang up on me. I've got almost all of my logistic slots on my bottleneck colonies pumping out frigates and cap ships non stop, and pretty much sit at the population cap, and still can only just barely hang on. 10 frig factories and and a capital ship factory pumping out all the frigates non stop, supported by dozens of guns and a handful of hangers. The computer never fights each other and seem to be able to send an endless stream of ships my way. The game reached this stalemate 2 hours into the game. I've played another 10 hours on the map with no progress whatsoever. Occasionally I'll break free, jump to the next planet, only to see a few hundred frigates waiting for me, and another few hundred warping towards the my now weakly defended planet.

 

23,794 views 17 replies
Reply #1 Top

Pretty much the only way to survive against more than one computer player is to obsessively run the errands the computers ask you to do.  Of course, it hands out errands without regard to whether you can actually do them ... so my experience is that playing against more than one computer generally ends up with a point where all the AIs want me to do something I can't do (e.g., because my fleet is committed trying to hold off the non-allied AIs), and then they all declare war at once and kill me.

 

I think the single-player mode in this game is something of an afterthought and not really meant to be played.

Reply #2 Top

Quoting lambdaman, reply 1
I think the single-player mode in this game is something of an afterthought and not really meant to be played.
End of lambdaman's quote

 

I gotta disagree with you on that one Lambdaman.  Yeah, Multiplayer is awesome, but I did find a sweet way for them to keep 'omglawlz gangup-ing' on me. 

You keep talking about how all the AI's want you to do nothing short of playing God for their people.  Yeah, that got annoying too, but I found that locking teams will keep them from ever asking you to do things for them.

My guess (because this happened to me before) is that you didn't satisfy their demands enough, so they went and asked the other AI's to do the same.  They became buddy buddy, and now all of a sudden you're the black sheep in the galaxy!  This happened to me because as soon as I stopped adhering to their demands, they ganged up on me too.

Try the Locked Teams option before you start the game.  When pirates are active I often place a bounty on a random person and they assume it's not you and place a bounty on each other, it's just funny.  Of course it's all random, but I think you'll have a lot less gangup problems when you Lock the Teams. :)

Let me know if that works for you.

Reply #3 Top

The AI don't have to do missions to ally. They can just do it right off the bat. Kind of is annoying.

Reply #4 Top

I only play single player and really like it.  I don't know how you get out of the predicament in your particular game.  But in a new game, if I play wiith unlocked teams, I try to become allied with at least one other player by performing the missions.  Usually I pick a player with a homeworld near to mine.  As soon as I get over 50% favorable rating I enter a cease fire and go from there.  On a 4 team map, one ally seems to be plenty.

If I don't want to be bothered with the missions, I choose lock teams from the Options memo when setting up the game.  That seems to stop the AI from cooperating against me, for the most part.  It also allows me to try out different teams (could I with two Easy TEC allies beat a team of three Normal Vasari?)

Reply #5 Top

Quoting Jetheren, reply 3
The AI don't have to do missions to ally. They can just do it right off the bat. Kind of is annoying.
End of Jetheren's quote

Ok, falls along the lines of what I said.  Force Locked Teams and you won't have to worry about an unfair advantage.

Reply #6 Top

Quoting Ovangkol, reply 4
As soon as I get over 50% favorable rating I enter a cease fire and go from there.  On a 4 team map, one ally seems to be plenty.
End of Ovangkol's quote

I just tried that on the latest attempt with no success as well. I got it to 90% and we had share vision/trade/peace treaties. When I gained a big strength advantage (while the other comps were still alive) that ally cancelled the treaty and after a minute started to attack me. I went from 90% to 0% instantly and was 3-way ganged up on again. It almost seems like they intentionally make it impossible on normal difficulty. I'd hate to see what hard feels like.

Reply #7 Top

Lock the teams.

Your trying to play the game the hardest way possible.

I either play with locked teams and everyone is at everyone, or I team up all the vasari in 1 team and all the advent in another. Then its me against 2 teams, who also hate each other.

It also helps if you play on maps with few phase lanes, so that you only ahve at most 3 choke points to worry about. Then as TEC, you put as many repair bays as you can in the entry path of the block point, so that your fleets can be regenerated during the battle. Also include robot ships for the same effect. As Vasari, you use nano weapons, which will make the incoming ships helpless long enough to kill them. Advent ahve something else that gives defenders an advantage.

Your block points need jump inhibitors covering the width of the incoming phase lane, and a balanced fleet to counter anything that comes. Plenty of strike craft on carriers is a help.

You need to figure out what fleet will hold at each block point. Then use whats left as a strike fleet. That should be at least a 1/3 of your ship limit, which makes a good fleet.

The secret to block points is to use everything the game provides to help everything else. If you miss out something important, your defence folds. When its all in place in the right amounts, then it can hold easily.

Reply #8 Top

 

Way back in my first two weeks as a Sins gamer when I was playing it in single player, I had the exact same problem in one of my early games.  As everyone else has mentioned, the solution is to just lock the teams.  You won't be able to have allies but neither will the computer opponents.

That having been said, after you've played the game in single-player for a few weeks and learned how to play all three races, definitely venture out to Ironclad Online and the online multiplayer game because after a while the AI becomes too predictable and easy to defeat and the real challenge comes from playing against live human opponents.  You can also get online right now even if your a noob and play humans v. AI games--that way you're still fighting the AI but at least you have human teammates and can enjoy chatting with them and learning to play the game better for them.  Just look for comp stomp games.

Reply #9 Top

I made the unfortunate mistake of not locking teams on my first 8 player map with AI on hard. I ended up with one or two key planets always being attacked. As a result, I had my entire fleet there with 7 repair platforms. Unfortunately, while I was holding off the enemy AI, I wasn't taking any worlds, I was distracted from my economy, and I wasn't doing missions. All of that combined to result in my allies going rogue. From there it was all downhill. I ended up wiping out an enormous amount of ships, and even a few of my allies fleets, at a modestly high cost.

At that point, I knew I was in trouble, but I figured if it could wipe out pink, who was right next to me and had only a planet and asteroid field, I could cut down my exposed flanks and start building up my economy. It would take awhile, but I'd win. Pink, however, was having nothing to do with this idea. Pretty soon, I've all but taken his asteroid field, and his fleet starts showing up from where-ever the heck it had been. Even though I was in 8th place for fleet size and had foolishly tried to play with no capital ships (not my best move), I was still winning against him, and even drove off an assault or two for the first few minutes thanks to my insane number of repair platforms. Then things got ugly. His friends showed up.

I was still trying to lock down that asteroid field when suddenly I was being steamrolled. Of course, things being as they were, it wasn't just pink's allies (and, by extension, MY old allies) come to call. It was everyone else and their grandmother too. So, at that point, with 3 different planets under attack by forces that completely outnumbered them even without the capital ships, a fleet already in tattered ruins, and ailing repair platforms, it was pretty evident that I was, well, screwed. And not in the good way. I surrendered, and checked the stats. It turns out that I had done rather well, even with as many mistakes as I'd made. I had at least a 2-1, possibly 3-1, kill to death ratio, and had killed about 10 capital ships, close to twice as many as anyone else had destroyed.

Being stubborn, I'm now trying to beat this match from a save point about an hour or so in, where my allies are still allies, my enemies are still enemies, and my fleet and economy still suck. That said, as I discovered yesterday (my second time through, after a few weeks hiatus), it's not impossible to complete missions, you just have to pick and choose when. I'm trying to keep them all above 80%, which isn't as hard as it sounds. The map is pretty open ended, even though I can't recall what it's name is, which gives me tons of places to defend but also tons of places to slip through, hit them in the rear, then run away.

The hard part is getting enough ships freed up to complete missions without losing them and weakening my defenses irrepairably. I ended up getting steamrolled by a huge enemy fleet that I didn't have a fleet big enough to defeat (3 enemy AIs sent practically their entire fleets. Go figure). The bad part is, even with major elements of 3 entire enemy fleets busy, my allies still didnt take the initiative to either defend my massively outnumbered defenses or launch a big counterattack elsewhere. We'll see what happens when I try again today...

Reply #10 Top

The broken part about allies is that they can turn on you at any time. What's the point of getting to 100% when they can just randomly attack you and drop it to 0% at any time. It seems all futile.

Reply #11 Top

I've never had an ally that is at 100% turn on me, yes I have had an ally who I failed to do missions for after getting to 100% and his allegiance declined so much that he did turn on me. I've never experienced that before, not saying that is doesn't happen, just that it hasn't happened to me.

Reply #12 Top

i'm new to the game myself , not had any trouble on a large random map with 7 AI's . Been tough at times for sure , but just hung in there .

Whenever i have had an allaince , the AI has neve broke it , and they have helped me immensely . I think you need an AI ally to survive.

In my current game (only my 3rd) i was being attacked on 2 sides by 3 AI's and was slowly sinking into defeat , i managed to get one of the 3 AI's onto my side , he then suddenly starting helping me in the middle of the war which turned the tide , god bless him . Not sure if i have just been lucky , but whenever i need help his fleet pops up just were i need it too save the day , i have grown fond off this AI ally :) .

Reply #13 Top

Quoting chiggachow, reply 10
The broken part about allies is that they can turn on you at any time. What's the point of getting to 100% when they can just randomly attack you and drop it to 0% at any time. It seems all futile.
End of chiggachow's quote

This isn't true though :P The AI does need to have at least one enemy, obviously, but they don't randomly break alliances especially from 100%. In fact, I've won plenty of games where I stayed allied to an AI and we won a mutual victory.

I gotta admit, I'm a bit dismayed that many are suggesting taking the easy way out and locking the teams. For me, that's just never been fun. Since the game's release I've been playing huge FFA maps with 9 Hard/Unfair AIs, and the dynamics of diplomacy make it different each time.

It's a lot easier not have to worry about it, to be sure, but it's perfectly possible not to get ganged up on. Securing even a cease fire gets 2 AIs off your back - the one you have a cease fire with, and the other that is now getting attacked instead of you by the one you've got a cease fire with. And the others can't really cross the entire map and territories of a bunch of others just to get to you, usually.

Reply #14 Top

I gotta admit, I'm a bit dismayed that many are suggesting taking the easy way out and locking the teams. For me, that's just never been fun. Since the game's release I've been playing huge FFA maps with 9 Hard/Unfair AIs, and the dynamics of diplomacy make it different each time.
End of quote

Exactly my thoughts...except I'm not playing against AI's of that caliber.

Reply #15 Top

I noticed AIs generate missions in most cases centering around neighbouring AIs (or players).

So if you have an AI in your neighbourhood and you shoot it (and you will), its most likely a gain in favour to somebody else in the vicinity.

Open up the diplomacy tab and see wich faction standing is raised by you (preemtive?) defense effords.

As soon as favour reaches 30% offer a chease fire treaty. Shooting a AI is decreasing favour, so you really don't want to shoot the factions with 30%+ standing unless you prefer being without allies or have a very good reason to do so.

Trade contracts should only be signesd if you CAN actually trade (ports) because this will reflect negatively upon you if you agree and can't really parcipiate and WILL be revoked and penalized.

Of course enemy AIs will still form treaties with each other but now you can participate accordingly.

You do not have to raid AI worlds or bribe AIs (even if it can help "picking" an ally at the cost of your expansion effords), simply defending your borders does the trick too.

The problem is not diplomacy mechanics, rather its poor documentation and the desaster new players are thrown into without a slight idea how to deal with the situation.

Reply #16 Top

I'm not sure about the Advent or Vasari, but the TEC has at least one tech that makes things easier as for diplomacy, which seems to escape most people's notice. If you want to play a team match without locked teams, it's a good idea to grab any techs reducing fallout from failing missions and increasing the amount of favor generated by successes. Unlocked teams strikes me as a great way to add depth to the game, particularly in team matches.

Reply #17 Top

I find 2 vs 1 games with locked teams the most dyanmic.

 

I make the sole AI enemy difficult and tailor my AI ally to suit my tastes and handicap. So far, I get to play defensive and offensive games without being overwhelmed by pirates or the AI..as I have the ally to absorb the constant drip-drip-drip of trouble.