Increasing Fleet Points and other Noob Questions

I LOVE this GAME

First, I'm no stranger to RTS games. They are my favorite. Second, I absolutely LOVE this game and have found the forum to be a wealth of knowledge. Third, I'm playing the "vanilla" Sins. I just downloaded it a few days ago. I have only played 2 games so far. Both FFA (1v1 small map, and the FFA on a medium size map).

I'm posting so early on because I'm running into the same problem in both games. Basically, I'm running out of logistics slots which is preventing me from having access to more technology. How do I increase my slots, I know I can increase the slots available but then it costs you money over all.

I guess I'm wondering how to efficiently manage the slots I have early in the game so that I continue to build military and civil structures, and thus move on to technologies which require 3-5 military or civilian structures around a planet.

The computer AI is all set to normal, normal speed for game and the computer faction is set to random. Also, I'm playing the TEC faction.

Ship Building: Does having two ship yards mean you will build ships faster? In some RTS's this is the case.


Lastly, on the screen which lists all the players, me, the AI opponents etc. You can it appears select the color and the design of your faction. Is that all this is? I noticed when I clicked on the orange "crest" next to me, it opens up another screen with a row up top..and then a larger set of rows of different designs and colors. What's this all about?

One last thing..Is there a setting for this forum to subscribe to your own post. I cannot seem to find this feature in any of the submenus below my screen name.

Thanks..I wish I had found this game years ago..WOW..I love it.

15,319 views 33 replies
Reply #1 Top

as far a logistical slots, there are two things to remember, use the menu on the lower right corner and the more planets you have the better, this game rewards quick expansion (to a point anyways) I rarely have more than one or two research structures per planet

as far as shipyards, yes and no, you don't get a bonus per shipyard but each shipyard will build a ship in the build order (ex. you have 5 ships set to build each shipyard will one of those ships, hence five shipyards will build that list faster than one because they do it at the same time)

lastly that is merely what you want for color and map graphical representation

Reply #2 Top

viper, for the answer to your LAST question, the answer is the My Posts next to the My Account on the options line

harpo

 

Reply #3 Top

we are glad you love this game (we love it too).

make sure you are upgrading your planets logistial slots, if you dont have 5 logistical structures on that volc/ice planet, and your out of slots, you need to upgrade the slots.  sometimes you cant just plain get enough labs, expecially on smaller maps, and part of the stratigy is chosing, oh, do i build 2 more labs for heavy cruisers, or do i build 2 trade ports?  (now... you can always demo (some!) labs and still have the effect once the lab is dead... so lets say, you wanted 2 civic labs so you could colonize ice/volc and build trade ports,  if you scuttle those labs, you will still be able to colonize ice and volcanic worlds, but you wont be able to build any trade ports.

almost never waste logistical slots with refinaries...trade ports are better 90% of the time, and it saves you (expecially as tec) a tier 4 research)

yes, two ship factories does not mean faster ship building... the ships will still build at the same rate, but you will be able to build multiple ships at the same time... put 10 frig factories on a desert world (with development mandate, of course), and you can build 10 different ships at the same time.  put a lv 6 sova there, and you got yourself an instafleet.

when you click on the crest, you are givin a screen where you can change it up. top row for color, the other buttons for the shape.

Reply #4 Top

Basically, I'm running out of logistics slots which is preventing me from having access to more technology.
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This is usually a sign of one of two beginner mistakes.  Either you aren't colonizing enough and don't have sufficient planets, or you're pursuing high-level technologies that your low-level empire has no business researching.  

For a typical 1v1 scenario, 3 of each lab is pretty much all you'll ever need (though Vasari may want to grab the 4th civic lab for trade ports).  The stuff above the 5 lab level is typically not appropriate for a 1v1 and is more tailored towards team games where you have one player who goes all-out military and one player who goes all-out economy and focuses on one tech tree exclusively.

As the others have mentioned, you can upgrade each planet to have additional logistics slots (a limited number of times), but this is very expensive and it's worth avoiding if you can.


I guess I'm wondering how to efficiently manage the slots I have early in the game so that I continue to build military and civil structures, and thus move on to technologies which require 3-5 military or civilian structures around a planet.
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You get two slots at the start of the game on your homeworld.  If the enemy is close to your start location, make them military, if he's far away make them civic.  If you don't know, scout before investing.

A colonized asteroid gives you 1 logistic slot, and a full-sized planet gives you 2 logistic slots.  So if you can pick up three full-sized planets and two asteroids, that's a total of eight slots (plus the two from your homeworld).  You'll need to spend a couple on other structures, but this small empire should be more than sufficient than to support the tech levels you need, even without spending a single penny on logistics upgrades.


Also, I'm playing the TEC faction.
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Your high priority technologies are bolded, and other useful techs are also listed.  Roughly in order of importance, but a lot of these guys can be skipped, and sometimes the other lower-level techs that I don't list here are useful.  The bolded stuff, though... if you have the labs for these techs, research them.  End of story.

Military:
* Repair Platforms (1 lab)
* Javelis LRM Frigate (2 lab)
* Hoshiko Robotics Cruiser (3 lab)
* Garda Flak Frigate (2 lab)
* Percheron Carrier (3 lab)
* 1st level Hull/Armour upgrades (1 lab)

Civic:
* Ice/Volcanic Colonization (2 lab) (though obviously only if there are ice/volcanics to colonize)
* Metal Extractor Efficiency (1 lab)
* Trade Ports (2 labs)
* Broadcast Center (3 labs)


Ship Building: Does having two ship yards mean you will build ships faster? In some RTS's this is the case.
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Each shipyard is capable of building one ship at a time.  So if you have three shipyards and you build only one ship, you gain no additional benefits.  However, if you have three shipyards and you queue up three ships, they will all be built simultaneously and appear at the same time.  

Usually players will build factories in multiple gravity wells so they can construct units where they need them, and if they need to quickly "pump" units they can simply have lots of planets working together.


You can it appears select the color and the design of your faction. Is that all this is? I noticed when I clicked on the orange "crest" next to me, it opens up another screen with a row up top..and then a larger set of rows of different designs and colors. What's this all about?
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You can select any combination of colour and crest you want.  You can set two players in the same game to use the same crest, but not the same colour.

Reply #5 Top

Hey guys!

 

Thanks a lot for the information. From reading, it sounds like I'm not expanding enough in terms of planets, and that I'm building too much at my initial planet when the game starts. I can see the stats at the end, and the computer is building faster, one of them build a capital ship instantly and put it around a nearby planet it colonized. I got nailed hours later by this faction.

I didn't know the following from above "you wanted 2 civic labs so you could colonize ice/volc and build trade ports,  if you scuttle those labs, you will still be able to colonize ice and volcanic worlds, but you wont be able to build any trade ports."

I assumed if you scuttled a structure you would lose the techs you researched. This is very good to know.

Regarding building ships and multiple factories: If I have 2 shipyards from the same planet, but want to build 10 ships. Must I select 5 ships per shipyard. That is clicking on both shipyards and queing 5 ships each, or can I click one 1 shipyard and que up 10 ships, and 5 will pop out from each yard?


Second regarding Harpo's answer to my question on subscribing to posts "viper, for the answer to your LAST question, the answer is the My Posts next to the My Account on the options line"

I checked it out already, and I do not see anything indicating how I can subscribe or unsubscribe to post, be it one I created, or a post created by another user.

Reply #6 Top

Quoting viper699, reply 5
Hey guys!
Thanks a lot for the information. From reading, it sounds like I'm not expanding enough in terms of planets, and that I'm building too much at my initial planet when the game starts. I can see the stats at the end, and the computer is building faster, one of them build a capital ship instantly and put it around a nearby planet it colonized. I got nailed hours later by this faction.

1. I assumed if you scuttled a structure you would lose the techs you researched. This is very good to know.

2. Regarding building ships and multiple factories: If I have 2 shipyards from the same planet, but want to build 10 ships. Must I select 5 ships per shipyard. That is clicking on both shipyards and queing 5 ships each, or can I click one 1 shipyard and que up 10 ships, and 5 will pop out from each yard?
End of viper699's quote

1. Ya, you keep some techs and lose others if you the labs get destroyed/scuttled. I only really scuttle labs as the Vasari because they get that improved salvage tech early and because of their good late game techs.

2. You actually can't select just one ship yards build que. The build menu you see is for the entire planet. So whatever ships you order will be worked on by all the ship yards at that planet, until there is no longer enough ships being built to keep them all busy. In short, don't worry about giving orders to each shipyard, just select the planet and give your build orders.

 

Reply #7 Top

one of them build a capital ship instantly and put it around a nearby planet it colonized.
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If you're not building a capital ship at the start of the game, you're making a huge mistake.  Your first capital ship is free, so there's literally no reason not to get this as soon as possible.

Other than that, colonization is simply your top priority in the early game and aside from military concerns (survival trumps everything else, obviously) you shouldn't do anything that would compromise your expansion.

I assumed if you scuttled a structure you would lose the techs you researched. This is very good to know.
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The only reason to ever scuttle labs is to research ice/volcanic colonization and then get rid of your civic labs to go pure military.  You should never scuttle military labs, and if you're actually getting a serious economy rolling you shouldn't scuttle civic labs either.

Regarding building ships and multiple factories: If I have 2 shipyards from the same planet, but want to build 10 ships. Must I select 5 ships per shipyard
End of quote

The planet itself has one build queue, and each shipyard will work on the next item in the queue.  There is no need to select each factory individually.

 

Reply #8 Top

Thanks again!

On the two random maps I mentioned above, my nearest planet was an artic planet or a volcanic one. So getting the colony for the artic via the civilian tech research is needed. I understand the build que process now..Thanks for the clarification. I will build a capital ship ASAP now. I had saved it towards the "end" after I had acquired a 2nd planet. At that point I was strong enough to fend off pirates easily (2.5 hrs into the game at normal speeds for all settings), but at least one computer or more was seriously more advanced than me, both in depth of ships it was building, and sheer number.

Also at this point is when I was running out logistics slots, and was unable to get certain techs which required 3 military or 3 civilian stations, depending on the game. Have to realize, I've only played 2 haha. Going to start a 3rd one tonight w/the new info from everyone and the reading I've done. Hopefully I won't have the problem again.

Incidentally, what is the significance of creating fleets? I know I can select/group ships together via Ctrl- 0-9, but how does a fleet differ? Benefits/drawbacks?

Again, does the forum automatically email you if someone replies to your post? I haven't seen an option for this, and certainly haven't received emails if this forum has this feature. Just wondering.

Reply #9 Top

Not much really in creating fleets aside from the fact that it pins the group to your Empire Tree (the view to the left of the screen) most don't even use them

as for the auto email, not that I am aware of

Reply #10 Top

On the two random maps I mentioned above, my nearest planet was an artic planet or a volcanic one.
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On random maps, there is always at least one ice or volcanic nearby, and one asteroid nearby.  It might not be linked directly to your homeworld by a phase lane, but it shouldn't be too far away.  Normally there is more than one phase lane leading away from your homeworld, so you have some choice in the direction of expansion.  If there is one or more of these ice or volcanics in your path, you usually need to get those civic labs operational at the start of the game.

after I had acquired a 2nd planet. At that point I was strong enough to fend off pirates easily (2.5 hrs into the game at normal speeds for all settings)
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That's a big problem.  Capturing two planets should take you no more than ten minutes, not two and a half hours!  I normally play on all fast game speed with quick-start (requires entrenchment), and I'm often running an empire of 4 or 5 planets after ten minutes.  Even on normal speeds with normal-start, I can run 2-3 by that point without issue. 

I'd recommend turning pirates off while you're still learning the game.  It's a distraction (and annoyance, in my opinion) that you can do without.

but at least one computer or more was seriously more advanced than me, both in depth of ships it was building, and sheer number.
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After two and a half hours, anything is within the realms of possibility.  You need to be actively scouting to know what's going on.  As a general rule, if the first you see of a powerful fleet is them knocking down your doors, it's probably too late to do anything about it.

Furthermore, you need to really pay attention to empire and economy sizes.  If someone is twice as large as you, you need to be attacking right now because that kind of size difference is close to unbeatable if they get to consolidate.

Incidentally, what is the significance of creating fleets? I know I can select/group ships together via Ctrl- 0-9, but how does a fleet differ? Benefits/drawbacks?
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I personally find fleets annoying and don't use them.  The biggest difference is that units will automatically join fleets, and you have to manually turn this feature off on every single unit you don't want to join your fleets.  This is what really kills the feature for me.

Basically you get a bunch of "cohesion" behaviors and the units will automatically try to stay in formation and fight as a team.  If you're comfortable with micromanagement, fleets don't do anything you can't easily do for yourself.

Reply #11 Top

Quoting Darvin3, reply 10

That's a big problem.  Capturing two planets should take you no more than ten minutes, not two and a half hours!  I normally play on all fast game speed with quick-start (requires entrenchment), and I'm often running an empire of 4 or 5 planets after ten minutes.  Even on normal speeds with normal-start, I can run 2-3 by that point without issue. 
End of Darvin3's quote

Sorry for the confusion. I had the 2nd planet early on. But I hadn't expanded beyond that. I guess I'm concerned if I expand too quickly, then I will get attacked be back down to one planet. I will not introduce pirates this time. They are a PAIN.  I will try another game and expand more quickly and see what happens. I'm trying to figure out the right balance between leaving my planet w/ defenses, having enough ships to defend the home planet, and a sizable enough force to go out and obtain new planets. I'm still having problems maintaining enough logistics slots. Perhaps I'm building too many structures around my initial, home planet.

I always send out two scouts immediately in the beginning and usually have them running continuously so I know how the others are doing.

Are the flight decks which let you build a small fighter/bomber squadron worth building?

Does setting up a trade port help you w/in your own empire even if none of the computer "players" don't trade w/you? Should I worry about the black market at this point?

One other question regarding structure building. When I capture a new planet. The ship that builds structures doesn't seem to phase jump between planets, how come? I'm constantly telling it to move along the phase line. It even seems reluctant to leave the gravity well.

Regarding the mining of asteroids from a neutral system. I did it once by accident, but forgot how. What ship do I use to plant mines in these asteroid systems? Second, if a comp. has already planted their metal/crystal mines in one of these neutral asteroid zones, does the TEC have a ship which would allow me to take over those facilities w/out having to destroy them and build my own on those asteroids?

 

Thanks again.

 

Reply #12 Top

Quoting viper699, reply 11


Sorry for the confusion. I had the 2nd planet early on. But I hadn't expanded beyond that. I guess I'm concerned if I expand too quickly, then I will get attacked be back down to one planet. I will not introduce pirates this time. They are a PAIN.  I will try another game and expand more quickly and see what happens. I'm trying to figure out the right balance between leaving my planet w/ defenses, having enough ships to defend the home planet, and a sizable enough force to go out and obtain new planets. I'm still having problems maintaining enough logistics slots. Perhaps I'm building too many structures around my initial, home planet.

 
End of viper699's quote

yeah build a lab or two and head on out conquering, unless you are right next door to the AI (there are maps the are like that) you should be safe to get 5 or 6 planets before you come face to face with a threat (the militia will never leave the planets). Also good job with the scouts, that is very important

 

Quoting viper699, reply 11

Are the flight decks which let you build a small fighter/bomber squadron worth building?


 
End of viper699's quote

for small attacks (if you ever play long term against a TEC player you will eventually see such attacks) but for a good size attack force you need either a fleet or starbase (starbases are with Entrenchment/Diplomacy only)

 

Quoting viper699, reply 11

Does setting up a trade port help you w/in your own empire even if none of the computer "players" don't trade w/you? Should I worry about the black market at this point?
 
End of viper699's quote

yes, trade ports work with in system, basically the money you receive is like taxes, the planets trade with one another and give you a cut.
As for the black market, it can be very useful if you have or need of a certain resource. I know I often will use it to quickly build a second cap (when I play the AI that is, be careful about doing this in MP )

Quoting viper699, reply 11

One other question regarding structure building. When I capture a new planet. The ship that builds structures doesn't seem to phase jump between planets, how come? I'm constantly telling it to move along the phase line. It even seems reluctant to leave the gravity well.

 
End of viper699's quote

Common mistake, the game doesn't explain this well. Each planet has its own structure builder and they are not phase lane capable and you can only use the upgrades to get more. (if one dies you have to wait for it to respawn so watch out during attacks)

 

Quoting viper699, reply 11

Regarding the mining of asteroids from a neutral system. I did it once by accident, but forgot how. What ship do I use to plant mines in these asteroid systems? Second, if a comp. has already planted their metal/crystal mines in one of these neutral asteroid zones, does the TEC have a ship which would allow me to take over those facilities w/out having to destroy them and build my own on those asteroids?

 
End of viper699's quote

You can't destroy them, ever. But you can use your frigate Colonizer (the Vasari use their scouts for this) to capture/steal them.

Reply #13 Top

yes, trade ports work with in system, basically the money you receive is like taxes, the planets trade with one another and give you a cut.
As for the black market, it can be very useful if you have or need of a certain resource. I know I often will use it to quickly build a second cap (when I play the AI that is, be careful about doing this in MP )
End of quote

 

Thanks A LOT! Two questions: 1. To use trade does each planet w/in my empire need its own tradeport?

 

2. Re: the blackmarket, at the bottom left and right are two boxes where a player can change some sort of modifier value. I have to admit, I don't exactly understand how it works. I think when I have checked, the values were about 3.6 I THINK? Regardless, how do I use those two buttons.

 

Reply #14 Top

1. yes each planet does one in order to add to the trade but, it may not always be the right choice, as you build a tradenetwork move your cursor over your credit account and a white line should appear on some of the phase lanes in your empire, this represents the most profitable trade loop and by placing the tradeports just right (some planets get them some don't) you can make this very long and very profitable

2. basically you can sell (theoretically) minerals at a lower price and undercut the market, in practice this doesn't work so don't worry about it

Reply #15 Top

I had the 2nd planet early on. But I hadn't expanded beyond that.
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Okay, that's still a problem but not nearly as serious. There are two reasons to stop your expansion:

A ) there is no room left to expand
B ) you're diverting your resources to actively fighting an enemy

Remember, if you stop expansion to build a fleet, you should be actively fighting (or at very least threatening your opponent) with that force.  Building a fleet and then doing nothing with it is suicide.


I guess I'm concerned if I expand too quickly, then I will get attacked be back down to one planet
End of quote

While that is a concern you need to be mindful of, you're stopping way too early.  The way to think about this is to ask yourself, am I close enough to attack my opponent?  If you're too far away to attack him, then he's too far away to attack you, and you're better off growing and consolidating to prepare for the fight.

Once you're in a position where you could be doing be doing battle with him, you can slow down your colonization and start "fleeting up".  However, you don't stop on a dime, you continue to advance towards the enemy and try to hit him hard.

On the typical randomly generated 1v1 map I'm usually launching my first attacks around the 20-minute mark and usually have the AI wrapped up around the 40-minute mark (I play unfair difficulty, by the way).  That's fast game speed, but it still gives you an idea of the kind of pacing you need to keep.


I'm trying to figure out the right balance between leaving my planet w/ defenses, having enough ships to defend the home planet, and a sizable enough force to go out and obtain new planets.
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Most of your backwater planets will never see a major battle, and that includes your homeworld in many cases.  Investing in static defenses here is usually a waste of money, since many will never get to fire a single shot, and even if they do they might be destroyed before backup arrives, which doesn't do any good either.

The bottom line is that the only defense is a mobile fleet that can respond to any threat on any planet.  You can always bolster up your front-line with defenses (since it will regularly see action) but if it's not a front-line planet don't sink cash into defenses there.

Similarly, it's usually a bad idea to leave units idle.  Instead, rely on your scouts to give you the heads up of an encroaching enemy.  This will allow you to get existing units into position before the enemy hits.  It's win-win; these units are out doing your dirty work for you, but on a moment's notice they can be called back to defend.

I'm still having problems maintaining enough logistics slots. Perhaps I'm building too many structures around my initial, home planet.
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Your homeworld should have a frigate factory, capital shipyard (you can probably scuttle that once you're done), and two labs.  You should colonize an asteroid and a full-sized planet within the first ten minutes and continue to move on.  That should give you 5 labs by the 10-minute mark, which is sufficient for any early-game purpose.  If you absolutely need to buy a logistics upgrade, then bite the cost and do it. It's something you avoid if you can, but if you need the logistics then you don't have much choice in the matter.

Try to build frigate factories on the front-line.  Particularly on maps like these your homeworld can easily become backwater, and building units there is a waste of time since they have to meander their way to the front lines.  Leaving a factory on your homeworld isn't a bad idea, persay, but two or three is a problem.  If your homeworld is near the front-line, however, it's a very good idea to have multiple frigate factories there.


I always send out two scouts immediately in the beginning and usually have them running continuously so I know how the others are doing.
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I usually use 4-6, but that's the right approach, you just need a couple more.


Are the flight decks which let you build a small fighter/bomber squadron worth building?
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Without Entrenchment, that's a solid NO.  The mobile carriers (both cruiser and capital ship) are very effective, but the immobile hanger is a waste of time.  


Does setting up a trade port help you w/in your own empire even if none of the computer "players" don't trade w/you? Should I worry about the black market at this point?
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You don't need a trading partner to build a trade network.  Trade is a great way to boost your credit income, but you need to build a trade route.  That means setting up multiple trade ports in a line.  Each additional link in the chain raises the income of every existing trade port.

As for the black market, that's a definite yes.  If you're suffering a chronic excess or shortage of one particular resource, then buy/sell it.  Don't use the black market as a tool of convenience, use it to correct income imbalances only.  The black market rate is essentially a scam, but if you have 2000 metal sitting around doing nothing, selling it is pretty much all you can do.


One other question regarding structure building. When I capture a new planet. The ship that builds structures doesn't seem to phase jump between planets, how come?
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Construction frigates cannot phase jump.  Each planet maintains its own constructors and they cannot be sent to build elsewhere.


Regarding the mining of asteroids from a neutral system. I did it once by accident, but forgot how.
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Colony frigate for TEC and Advent.  If you're playing as Vasari, it's your scout.

has already planted their metal/crystal mines in one of these neutral asteroid zones, does the TEC have a ship which would allow me to take over those facilities w/out having to destroy them and build my own on those asteroids?
End of quote

Doesn't matter if they've been claimed by someone else, a colony frigate can still capture them for you.  This makes these neutral extractors easy to capture... and easy to lose.

Reply #16 Top

Try to build frigate factories on the front-line.
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Firstly, thank you all for your excellent help it's been most informative. Second, quick question I understand the need for building frigate factories on the front line. However, how do you determine where the front line will be? For example, maybe I'm able to obtain a few more planets from my homeworld, but maybe the next two end up being planets that are constantly in chaos due to fighting w/the computer AI. I don't want to end up establishing a forward planet w/factories and such only to have them demolished, yet I don't want to give a planet up either. Perhaps that's the fun of the game.

You guys have been really helpful. I just love this game so much, and I've barely touched the surface, let alone multiplayer. If I can watch people play (I think the game lets you do that, I hope I don't need Dip/Entrench to do so), then I will watch some people play and learn a bit.  I know I will end up getting the expansion packs.

Reply #17 Top

However, how do you determine where the front line will be?
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I've already discussed the importance of scouting.  You have to know where your opponent is, and anticipate when you will encounter each other, and make sure frigate factories are set up nearby when that happens.  You don't need them to right there in the middle of combat (though that can be useful), just close enough that reinforcements don't have to travel very far.  Beyond that, it can be nearly impossible to nail down a front line definitely.  You don't know where the enemy is going to strike (though the AI is a bit predictable in this way) and as you win and lose battles this is going to change.  The only real solution is to build new frigate factories as the situation requires it.  That's just a normal operating cost of your empire, and it can even be somewhat useful to have one frigate factory on three planets rather than three factories on one planet.  Ultimately, though, how you to choose to lay these guys out is your own call.

 

I don't want to end up establishing a forward planet w/factories and such only to have them demolished
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Actually, this is exactly what you should be doing.  When an experienced player captures a new planet and expects the enemy to attack it any time, he immediately builds three structures right next to each other:  a frigate factory and two repair platforms.  This magic combination allows you to keep your units alive for longer and to replace dead units very quickly.  In a battle of attrition, this is one of the most cost-effective and dangerous defensive combos.

Best of all, this arrangement is even helpful when battles are going on up to two jumps away.  You can use the frigate factory to build extra reinforcements to help out somewhere nearby, and injured units (particularly capital ships) can retreat back to this location to be repaired.  It's not uncommon to have capital ship fall back, be fully repaired, and rejoin the same battle.  That's game-changing.

It's true that the factory could be destroyed, but this goes back to what I was saying about scouts; you need to keep tabs on the enemy so your defenders are in position before they arrive.  Sure, the enemy could make a beeline for the factory and try to knock it down, but the repair platforms will keep it up for some time, and your defending units will be pounding on the enemy the whole while. 

 

Perhaps that's the fun of the game.
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Casualties are normal.  Losing a frigate factory has nothing on losing capital ships.  Heck, in a typical late game multiplayer battle I run through capital ships like toilet paper.  Casualties are part of the game, and how you manage them is a big part of your strategy and the fun. 

 

I just love this game so much, and I've barely touched the surface, let alone multiplayer.
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Multiplayer is really fun, and an entirely new level of challenge over singleplayer.  There are lots of people who can help you pick up the multiplayer ropes, because it is a big jump over the AI.  That said, almost all of the advice I've given you so far is good for multiplayer as well as singleplayer.

 

Reply #18 Top

Hey guys,

 

After all your tips, I'm doing much better!!! In a 4 player FFA (comps), I'm doing very well getting many planets. I have squashed 2 races, made some alliances...But I think the last comp is gonna kick my butt. It's OK.I have a better handle on things now.

 

One question.  I have a lot of planets, and well established techs, including broadcasting towers set up at a couple planets.  However, during the late game portion, one of my planets is only 1 phase jump away my empire, and my AI enemy. This particular planet doesn't have a broadcast tower.  In any event, out of no where, I get an alert telling me the planet's allegiance is dropping. And basically in about 10 minutes maybe? I lose the planet because my AI comp's influence is too strong. I never got attacked by this guy yet either. How does this happen, and how do I prevent this in the future??

Thanks

Reply #19 Top

viper, it is a good idea to put one(OR MORE) broadcast tower(s) at EACH world to BOOST your alliegence AND productivity, and also slow the enemy culture if not push it back.

harpo

 

Reply #20 Top

Are you playing against the advent? In the late game they can build culture cannons (superweapons) which sends a huge culture hit to any planet the players wishes. This is more common in single player than multiplayer though, as in multiplayer its consider to be weak and inefficient as far as superweapons go

Reply #21 Top

he may have lost because it was too far from the homeworld it happened to me once on a dead asteroid, i made sure those ppl got what they deserved hehehehe

Reply #22 Top

@viper699

Upon colonizing a planet, the initial allegiance level is determined by how far that planet is from your homeworld...the MAX allegiance is the maximum allegiance that planet can have....this MAX allegiance is 10% higher than the initial allegiance, and friendly culture will push you up from the initial x% to the max (x+10)%...

It is important to keep in mind that planets far from the homeworld have very little initial and max allegiance...the game is set up so that any planet more than 5 jumps from your homeworld has an initial allegiance of 25% and a max of 35%...the fastest your culture can increase or decrease is about .07% per second (its actually a little less, some strange decimal)...if you do the math with the exact value, a newly colonized planet with 25% allegiance under heavy enemy culture can be lost within 6 minutes...

If you select a planet, and then look at the bottom center, there should be a picture of the planet...to the immediate left will be three values...one of them (I believe the middle one) represents the allegiance of the planet...if you hover your mouse over this value, a little window will pop up...this window will show you the current allegiance, max allegiance, and rate of change in allegiance (red is negative, green is positive)...as a rule of thumb, if the rate of change is -.07% (the maximum rate you can lose allegiance), you have about 1 minute for every 5% of allegiance left to change the situation...this rule gives you some buffer time...

There are three direct ways to fight culture:

1) Build the culture orbital structure

2) Research culture technologies

3) Place capital ships in the gravity well

Capital ships do not create culture....but they help strengthen already existing culture...the fastest and easiest way to help resist enemy culture is to put a capital ship or two there...but this is not a good long term solution and can cost you a tactical advantage since your capital ships aren't on the offensive with the rest of your fleet...

The best way to deal with culture is to have culture facilities up before there is a problem...since allegiance affects your resource and credit income, there is some economic advantage to having culture up as well...I'd highly recommend having at least one culture facility on all planets (not asteroids) regardless of location...you will also need AT LEAST one culture facility on each frontline planet...since each planet has a limit on logistic slots, it is generally a good idea to have your research facilities on your core worlds...this will allow you to have more culture facilities on your frontier worlds, where resisting enemy culture is most important...

Researching culture technologies is a very long term solution, though they do make your culture noticeably stronger...these technologies also do provide military bonuses for ships in friendly culture, but most players don't research them early on...

Some things to keep in mind:

Culture takes time...if you build a culture facility at a planet, it will take time for the rate of change to become positive (or less negative)

It is possible that enemy culture will cause your allegiance to go down to a fixed level, but then stop...for example, you might start at 35% allegiance, and enemy culture is strong enough to have it go down to 25%, but won't be strong enough to lower it anymore...

Culture takes overwhelming force...if one of your planets borders an enemy planet, and you have two culture facilities on yours while the enemy has 3, it is unlikely you will lose the planet even though they have more culture...just because a phase lane leading to your planet is dominated by your enemy's culture doesn't mean your planet is threatened...it might just mean they have slightly more culture than you...

Advent starbases can propagate culture with the right upgrades, but I have never seen the AI do this...the culture on these things can be very powerful however...

Deliverance engines (Advent superweapon) can propagate culture at the targeted planet...however, the affect is not permanent and I have never seen an AI build a superweapon...

It is unlikely you will encounter either of these things in multiplayer or single player...

Reply #23 Top

I get an alert telling me the planet's allegiance is dropping. And basically in about 10 minutes maybe? I lose the planet because my AI comp's influence is too strong. I never got attacked by this guy yet either. How does this happen, and how do I prevent this in the future??
End of quote

If enemy culture is too strong on a planet, then loyalty will begin to drop there.  If loyalty hits zero, you lose control of the planet as if it had been bombed out.  Building more broadcast centers nearby is the solution.  Stationing a capital ship in the gravity well can also slow down enemy culture, but this is like bailing water, it's a very temporary solution.

Culture is generally slow, so you have plenty of time to fix the problem.

Reply #24 Top

Hey guys...

Well, fortunately I have saved the game at different time points. I played into very late end game recently, SO late I had the ability to build the TEC super weapon. Basically it's just me and the last AI which is also TEC. The difference from what I can tell in scouting, is the comp has significantly more capital ships than I do. They are all level 7 or more. I have a good amount same level, but it has more. It has about equal number of lesser ships.  At one point, I was moving my force into one planet after another, never able to defeat all it's force as it would just run and leave to another planet of its own. I would end up capturing the new planet, and would keep or lose the planet depending on the tips from above which I have been incorporating. I feel like I'm at a stalemate haha. We each pretty much the same amount of planets. I'm certainly going to give it another try.

 

At one point in a very large battle I noticed my Marza decided on its own to attack the planet instead of ships!! How does that happen? I love the Marza. It seems the battles involve more micromanagement than I thought perhaps?

Second stratagy I noticed by the TEC AI, is that is has either equal or maybe 1/4-1/3 more Percheron Carriers than I do. In conjunction, I noticed in one battle the AI's Hoshiko Robotics ships were flying more tightly with capital ships (no doubt repairing them as I attacked the capitals) My question is, how do I deploy that stratagy for my own capital ships?

Lastly, are Garda Flak Frigates the best offense against all the bombers/fighters launched from carriers and capital ships? I have not used them too much at all. My attack force is the Hoshiko/Carrier/Cap ships/and that Heavy gun ship (I forget the name, it has an impulse engine upgrade).

One more re: culture. I have 2 planets and an asteroid owned by TEC AI. I know I can take them because I did recently. However, on 2 of plantets which are definitely beyond the boundary of my domain and the AIs (by about 2-3 jumps) I can wipe them out, but cannot build on the planet because "the planet's culture or allegiance is too high" is there a way to get around this?

I'm loving this game!

Reply #25 Top

^Capital ships are only supposed to start bombing a planet if all military targets are eliminated. What might of happened is that you had its raze planet ability purchased and on autocast, so it stopped and used that and continued to bomb the planet.

If you right click one of your frigates and (I think) right click a capital ship, it will always follow it around and try to stay next to it. I always make sure one of my repair cruisers is following my caps as well.

Flak frigates are excellent against fighters, but only okay against bombers. They also have ridiculously high defense for their cost and fleet supply. Some people can use them really well but it requires a lot of macro (you have to position them so they can fire from all sides to get the most out of them). Otherwise, only build a lot if the AI has a fighter spam going.

Also, I'm surprised the AI has more high level capital ships. While the AI doesn't really focus fire one capital ships, in general players most certainly should. At least get your LRMs, bombers and capital ships to all focus on his highest leveled cap and start taking them out one by one.