<noob

1) fleet cohesion settings; set them to be less strict.  

2) choosing when to build new capital ships (and which ones to build) is a huge decision.  You can't reduce it down to a formula.  You'll get more muscle (hit points and damage) from buying frigates rather than capital ships, but you'll get more utility and long-term growth potential out of a capital ship.  It all depends on your needs and strategy.

If you lose a capital ship, it's a good idea to replace it.  New capital ships carry the price tag of that expensive crew upgrade, which is why you have to carefully consider when to build them.  I typically do not scuttle my capital ship factory; unless you are Vasari scuttling gives you only a tiny fraction of the resources back, so unless you desperately need that logistical slot it's not worth it.

3) the best defense is a good offense.  It's surprisingly hard to take advantage of defenseless enemy worlds when a massive fleet that outnumbers you is destroying your worlds!  Static defense is extremely expensive, so you're better off not building turrets or hangers and putting that money into your fleet.  The only static defense that's really worth your time is the repair bay, since this gives you a haven for injured ships to retreat back to in addition to a strong advantage when defending. Another great defensive tool is the frigate factory; if the enemy sends a couple units to harass you, just build a couple units of your own to fight back.  If he sends more, build more.  The combination of frigate factory and repair bays is usually enough of a home-turf advantage to repel any minor invasion force and hold out long enough for your main fleet to arrive against a major one.

4) typically a new unit will join the largest fleet in the gravity well it's entering.  If your fleets are organized by unit types (as I do in the rare occasions I use fleets) it will join the fleet of the same unit type. 

5) a starbase is a speedbump, not a bulwark.  You are correct that they won't stop an enemy.  What they're supposed to do is slow him down, giving your fleet time to react and outmaneuver him.  They also have unique tactical utility that varies from starbase to starbase.  A TEC starbase can be used to produce and repair units, making it a useful staging point for long-term assaults when far from home turf.

Against the AI, the best strategy is to fortify one world that it likes to attack, use all the tactical slots. Make sure there is a phase jump distruptor. When they attack, your defenses and fleet will eventually make them retreat and the phase distruptor gives ou time to destroy as many ships as possible. Immediately after, attack the planet that the AI retreated to. Their fleet will be damaged and that will outweigh the home-turf advantage.

Against a human,  do what the AI would do, attack the world where your opponent's fleet is. Only use a small portion of your fleet, and then retreat to a moderately fortified world. They will more than likely send a scout to see what is on your world, so make sure just the small and damged fleet is there. Once the scout is gone, move the rest of your fleet to that world (again, make sure there is a phase distruptor) and when the enemy attacks surprise should give you an advantage and the phase jump disruptor will make their retreat very costly.

This is a very generic strategy that works with all the races to different degrees.

1) fleets are not the best way to manage units, as they spend most of their time reforming. You can order the whole fleet to focus fire on a sequence of ships and they wont reform in between kills

2) When to get new capital ships is based on personal preference, but advent fleets usually bring out second and third caps earlier than the other races. Except on very small maps, the advent will usually start with a progenitor colonizer cap, the TEC with a Marza dreadnaught (in almost all cases), and the Vasari with the mighty space egg colonizer cap

3) Again, this is highly situational, if your enemy seems content to only attack frontline worlds, then you need no fleet presence at the first few planets. But a few long range frigates and support ships with disabling abilities will probably be enough to deter a small raid

4) Fleets are unwieldy at best, but you can (although it is a pain) go to the fleet management menu for every new ship and turn off the auto join fleet command.

5) A starbase will stop an AI dead in its tracks and will give a less experienced player a hard time, but to anyone with a moderate knowledge of the game, they are far too vulnerable to bomber strikecraft too pose much of a threat.

Keep playing and you'll figure out what works best for you, Good Luck!

thks for the quick responses    that really helps

but from what you guys are saying it looks like ur not using the fleets at all just having a bunch of ships here and there which i understand but how do  u split them up  as in say i have 20 lrf and i want to send 15 of them to defend another planet  how do i only select 15 cuz on my tree it has them in stacks on 10 how do i split that last grp of 10 into 5

also i know u can shift click to attack diff ships in a row  only problem there is im not excalty great with what ships are good/weak against others ships so i like the fact that they auto attack -i might try not forming fleets tonight

Yeah, I personally do not use fleets.  More trouble than they're worth IMO.

Rather than selecting exactly fifteen, I'll select roughly fifteen.  Zoom in, drag-and-select about as many as you want, then send them off on their way. 

In many cases it makes more sense just to construct new units from a nearby frigate factory rather than splitting up your army.  When my fleet is more than 6 jumps away (or in the middle of a fight) this is almost always what I do.

This will come with more experience, even if you don't look at the damage multiplier charts you will eventually get a sense of what ships to use against what ships; lrfs against lfs, fighters against siege frigates and so on. If you like excessive micro then the advent will probably be your favorite race after awhile. I started with TEC and then never got a firm hold on vasari tactics, and now play exclusively advent.

As for what ships are good against other ships, the long range frigates murdering light frigates is probably the most important. Bombers kill Heavy cruisers and capital ships and structures. Fighters kill just about everything else other than flak frigates. Light frigates are "good" against carriers and support cruisers, but don't rely on them too far

TEC is very generic and great for macro.  Advent is almost entirely military (and awesome btw).  Vasari is a combination of military and economy.  Both the Advent and Vasari require heavy microing to be effective.

And there is a chart on the forums talking about what kills what.  It is stickied.

Sorry, but coming from an ex-Warcraft III player, nothing in Sins requires heavy micro.  In fact, fighters are probably the most demanding thing in the game in terms of micro (by a long-shot) and that's faction independent.

Advent has the strongest fleets in a straight fight, TEC has the cheapest and most easily replaceable fleets, Vasari is extremely weak overall (both in terms of unit costs and performance) but has some incredible advantages over the other factions in less direct ways.

In terms of econ, Advent starts good and becomes crap, Vasari starts good, becomes crap mid-game, and becomes good again late game, and TEC starts as crap but quickly becomes the best and stays there.

In terms of econ, Advent starts good and becomes crap, Vasari starts good, becomes crap mid-game, and becomes good again late game, and TEC starts as crap but quickly becomes the best and stays there.

i do play as advent and i have noticed that i start off strong and end game  i find myself scrambling for resouces once i tech into high fleet's   -what i normaly do is just start strong and wait a bit until my resoures are like 50k,3-4k for cash,metal      is there a more efficent way then this to do it  -and yes i am using trade ports and those things which increase my metal exstraction( cant remember name)

p.s. thank you all for not just cutting me down and calling me a noob and saying things like L2p   i came for wow and to say the least im loving these fourms   almost every1 says something to try and help out us new players    even if you already have said it a million times before  so thks again

You can do that against the AI, because they're idiots, but a player will murder you because they will have turned that cash (even if they're earning less due to upkeep) into units and killed you in the meantime.  A better plan is to spend that cash to conquer planets and make your economy stronger, enabling you to raise your fleet capacity.

@Darvin: I was comparing them to the TEC which requires almost no micro aside from MB.

Anyways...

Remember, the Advent can take fleets more than 2-3 and sometimes 4 times their size.  Use this to your advantage.  Don't get extra fleet supply slots unless you REALLY need them.  You will be getting fewer resources than TEC/Vasari, so keep your upkeep costs as low as possible.  If playing MP, try to link up with a TEC feeder.  When a good Advent player is fed by a good TEC feeder, you get an extremely powerful fleet.  You have the econ of the TEC and the might of the Advent.

What I recommend doing in the case of the Advent for resources is when you have lava/ice planets with 4 roids, place five TP's there and set them all to focus.  Each one will yeild a ~20% buff to the output.  On terran/desert/roid, don't use resource focus.  Its not going to do much.  Although, if you get Massive Pure Glaciers, put all your TP's to use getting credits.  +30% is a really nice buff.

As I said, maneuvering your fighters is the biggest micromanagement challenge you have in this game, followed by maneuvering your fleet.  This is largely the same for every faction. 

Or get that extra fleet supply and crush your enemy beneath your boot.  Whatever floats your boat.

Resource focus costs a lot money to bring out.  In fact, unless those ice/volcanic worlds are within two jumps of your homeworld, you're better off keeping them as trade ports and buying the metal crystal off the black market, resource focus is that bad.  Once you have its high level (6 lab iirc) upgrades, it's decent, but honestly most of the time it's just not worth the effort of pursuing.

Very late game, resource focus combined with allure of the unity combined with induced reverence can have fantastic results, but we're not talking until 2-3 hours into the game that this combo becomes viable.

I know that fighters are the biggest microing needed, I'm just saying that TEC requires none and the others require more.

True, but I prefer to not go on a massive offensive until later..  Econ first, military second.  I was saying that because it sounds like that might be how he plays as well...

And I was talking about late-game.  

Oh, and btw, make sure that if playing with pirates that you get karmatic retribution.  A single downed trade ship yields a bounty of 200 on their head.  Makes them expend extra credits to keep up with you.

*shrug* I don't feel any different in micro between the various factions.  Guess it's just my Warcraft III background talking.  The difference between the factions of Sins just doesn't even register on the scales for me.

Gotta be specific about that; resource focus is something you usually bring out after allure of the unity, which is very late game indeed.  Usually you want all your crystal/metal upgrades, allure of the unity, and the improved resource focus upgrades before you start using it.  I personally will have a starbase with induced reverence set up before I start resource focus.  Really one of the most marginally useful abilities in the game, but once you start stacking all of Advent's loyalty bonuses it starts looking good.

The big problem is that by the time you're getting resource focus you often already have 200 credit/second trade routes in operation.  Unless you're absolutely starving for crystal and metal and are being gouged on the black market, economics are often a moot point anyways this late in the game.

But never do this in a FFA scenario, because this gives massive amounts of bounty for your enemies to collect.

Actually, can allies collect on the bounty of karmic retribution?  I seem to recall the rules for allies collecting bounty that you placed on enemies was a little fuzzy...

As advent, it might be more beneficial to let the pirates attack you early to mid game to get experience for your caps. A high level mothership, battleship, or battlecruiser breaks 100 dps for a single weapon. Late game pirates become negligible because of defences and larger fleets; they basically are free experience at that point. Karmic retribution is useful on a smaller map when you want to divert your opponent's attention and take extra planets. Personally, i never use it.

Vasari require the most micro, they have the weakest units overall and some of the most useless abilities (arguably)

TEC units are basically tanks, they require little micro because there just isnt that much to micro with.

Advent do not require too much extra micro after you figure out the best placement for your capital ships to execute synergies that can kill entire fleets, animosity, vengence, malice, cleansing brilliance. And when to activate repulse. Even a small advent fllet can tank a missle barrage with no losses with a few guardians, and a mothership with shield restore.

An advent player will rarely need more than the third or fourth levels of fleet supply, and that will mostly consist of caps, crusaders, and drone hosts. Along with a moderate number of illums, and a scattering of guardians and subjugators.

TEC need higher levels of fleet supply, but who cares, they can afford it...

Vasari need the highest levels of fleet supply and their research that increases ship slots because their ships are just not that cost effective. Personally, i cannot win a large game as vasari because once TEC and advent get going, the vasari early game advantage does not matter.

The TEC and advent start fairly similarly, rather weak with a wet paper bag for an economy, then the advent slowly gains power militarily and the TEC slowly gains economic dominance. Vasari (provided there are enough neutrals) starts with a better economy and military, but loses this strenght throughout the rest of the game

Should be noted that once they reach the late game Vasari once again become competitive, if only due to phase stabilizers which are a massive bonus.

Phase stabilizers add mobility and fluidity, good for choosing where to attack, but invade a planet they cannot afford to lose and (most of the time) the weaker and more costly vasari fleet will not be able to make a substantial dent in an advent fleet. And any TEC ships lost will simply be replaced.

The easiest way i have found to use vasari is hit and run, above all DO NOT allow your enemy the chance to choose where to attack, You must make them fight where they do not want to and run away once the odds tip in the enemy's favor. Use phase stabilizers to attack opposite ends of enemy territory spontaneosly and again run once the enemy fleet appears. Do this enough until they split their fleet and then hopefully you can catch one of the fleet fragments and gain a decisive victory. This is a much more complex strategy than the advent or TEC require.

Advent: move to world, kill everything, move on. Minimal losses.

TEC: Same as advent except replace lost ships.

The main problem with, the vasari strategy is that if the enemy knows what you are trying to do they will avoid splitting their fleet and simply fortify worlds to slow you down and invade the planets you have left open, forcing you to fight them head on.

The problems with the TEC and Advent strategy is the possibility of being out-manuevered, a single block of ships can only be in one place and attacks coming from all sides are harder to counter than a large fleet directly ahead.

If the game came down to a straight fight of attrition, Vasari won't survive till late game anyways.  The fact that you've made it that far speaks volumes that the game isn't simply a battle of who has the most cost-effective frigates.  Advent are extraordinarily powerful in a direct confrontation, but force them into a prolonged two-front war or three-front war and that advantage isn't nearly as decisive.

This is the strategy the vasari have perfected, phase gates allow the entire fleet to attack one side of an empire ann then the other in a very short amount of time, a huge tactical advantage. The problem is if the enemy slows you with defences thenan advent fleet can steamroll your planets until you are forced to fall back and defend them. I am not arguing the vasari are a bad or inferior race to play, but they require more macro level strategy to realize the advantages they possess.

Survival is not so much the issue as a straight fight. Strategy only goes as far as planning where, what, and when to attack. Once battle starts the inferiority of their ships is a hard disadvantage to overcome. It can be done, it has been done, but the vasari cannot stand a prolonged war on home territory nearly as long as the advent or TEC . The beginning of a game is the most critical time for the vasari, capture neutrals and expand as rapidly as possible. You will need the resources to survive the mid game. Once Heavy cruisers come out, guerilla warfare becomes a neccesity. Attack, withdraw, attack somewhere else. Do not give your enemy the freedom of choice, keep beating them in multiple places until they falter, and then just keep pushing. Keep them under constant pressure, scout to know where they are weak. To quote Sun Tzu "Avoid where you enemy is strong; Attack where he is weak" "Know your enemy and know yourself and you need not fear the outcome of 100 battles"

The vasari have strenghts, but it is not in straight combat; which makes sense for a race on the run for 10,000 years.

The advent have incredibly powerful ships and ability combos and the TEC have numbers, play to your strenghts, exploit your enemies weaknesses.