the_Monk the_Monk

How to: see/connect-to/host SERVERS!

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How to: see/connect-to/host SERVERS!

from Sins Forums

I have already posted this information to several other forums including the World in Conflict forums where it has received much attention and helped many people with posts such as "I can't connect to servers" , "I can't see all the servers" , "my friends can't see/connect to my server" etc. I have decided to post it again and hopefully it'll be made into a sticky!

I work in IT (design complex NAT/network structures for coporate clients) so that's how I know what I'm talking about. Second, I've had my server the Monk's [PROVING GROUNDS] running a dedicated server for most multiplayer games released since HW1/Operation Flashpoint, so anyone with game hosting issues, ask away! NAT and the misconceptions/inability to configure it are the single largest cause for people not being able to see/connect to/host internet servers today!

 

A quick lesson on NAT:

NAT (Strict) - Port AND Address-restricted NAT (the router/firewall insists that the packet return from both the same IP Address AND Port the packet was originally sent out to)

NAT (Moderate) - Port-restricted NAT (the router/firewall insists that the packet return from the same Port the packet was originally sent out to but doesn't care if the IP Address isn't the same)

NAT (OPEN) - Port AND Address independent NAT (the router/firewall doesn't care which Port OR IP Address the return packet comes from and simply forwards the data packet on to the internal IP you will have specified in your "port-forwarding") Obviously OPEN-NAT is the least secure and also by extension the most flexible for hosting/connecting-to games.

MOST games will work having TCP set to STRICT and UDP set to MODERATE. ALL games will work setting both TCP and UDP NAT filtering to OPEN. (your routers may or may not even let you modify NAT filtering, many SOHO routers do not!) I have "real" routers/firewalls (very expensive also ) so I have granular control over many things that many SOHO routers don't even reference such as the above.

If your router DOES allow NAT control then my suggestions above willwork! Plain and simple. NAT, when not implemented with any sort of controls (like on many SOHO routers, and crappy retail anti-malware/firewall software) is the single biggest reason for sour gamers!

Happy gaming/hosting, monk out!

xfire: the1monk

 

EDIT: here is a link a "networking guide for the gamer" I wrote which may also come in handy the "Networking for the Gamer" guide I compiled of all the "generic" networking information I posted to various forums.

EDIT:

Here is the link to my SINS-specific guide "Networking and SINS" (version 1.0 written Feb 14/2008) which contains all information necessary in order to play/host SINS!

http://themonk.ca/Monk/Networking_and_Sins_by_the_Monk.pdf

technical
317,823 views 134 replies
Reply #51 from Sins Forums Top
Dude, are you getting put-off because I'm adding my input to your thread? I'm not saying you're not helping people, I'm just adding to it. I only had an issue with the terminology you were using when discussing NAT, but never have I insinuated you don't know what you're doing or talking about. Relax...you can take all the credit.
End of quote




No one is getting "put-off". I was responding to your earlier post (#46) not the one you moved.


quote from you:

"Looking over the pleas for help, I see that individual step-by-step guides for any/all home user routers would be immensely helpful! I can put together one for the DL-4300 Gaming Lounge, once I can get some free time."

my response:
I was pointing out that I have given "step-by-step" guides I just don't want to litter this thread with them as places like www.portforward.com already have them. I understand that in the cisco-world :) my terminology wouldn't be recognized, however as I pointed out I took my "terminology" straight from the help file on a D-Link DGL-4300 (gamerlounge router) which you've said you would write a guide for. :D Not a tad ironic? hehe


quote from you:

"What would really be cool, anyone that has MP setup and working, please create instructions (screenshots a plus!) and post them here. List make, model, firmware version of your router too. Sometimes they can be the same model, but one has newer code and has changes that affect the configuration. Listing the OS of the hosting machine (e.g. your PC) and what firewall and/or anti-virus/spyware application(s) you are using (and how you have them set) is a must. If you don't have time to make the guide, but want to help anyway...let someone know here, maybe I can be persuaded to make it for you!?!?!"

my response:

I have posted how I've gotten MP to work. To quote myself:
"
1. As I've pointed out earlier in this thread, only TCP is used for this game.
TCP port 6112 <-- gameport
TCP port 6000 <-- connection to IC-online


2. I've also pointed out several times (and then personally helped many) to make sure you're not only OPENING ports for traffic (ie. like through a software firewall etc.) but that if you have a router in-between your PC and the internet you need to make sure to FORWARD that traffic from your router to your PC (the correct IP address).


3. My testing has also concluded that several people who had already used my instructions/guide and opened/forwarded everything correctly had an issue where Windows Live Onecare and Windows Defender "silently" block this game's connection. These people that I've helped with that issue have temporarily "killed" the windows processes "MSASCui.exe and MsMPEng.exe" which enables flawless gaming/hosting through IC-online. (I have notified MS about this issue and hopefully they'll update it in a future definition update.)


quote from you

"A note...by helping your fellow gamer out, just increases the pool of MP n00bs out there for all you experienced players to obliterate (i.e. it's in your best interests to help these guys out!) HEHE!"

my response

See the above where I say "I have been helping. I've only ever been interested in keeping things simplified, so that I have less to explain in "follow-up" posts (this isn't the first game I've lent considerable network support to a game via forum posts and TS), I know the methods that work, and those that might only serve to confuse people more which is why I've posted "generalized" information here, to get everyone on-track with WHAT they need to do and if they can't figure out HOW to do it themselves (ie. forward ports, open firewalls, disable anti-malware, relax-Nat if needed) then I've made myself available to talk them through it all.  :D 


Those, and nothing more were my points.

-monk out!
Reply #52 from Sins Forums Top
@ the Monk

LOL! ;-P

Since I do agree some users are lazy, I feel they need a little more coddling is all...links don't cut it sometimes! Maybe a PM for your "points" are in order? To some people, it may look like a flame war is going on! I'm really not trying to start one! It's OK though, I'll go piss in another pond! (comical figure of speech) ;-p

My DL-4300 guide isn't up yet, as I haven't set it up yet. Like you, I haven't much of a chance to play it. This weekend I'll have it set up, since I'll be playing with some friends I introduced to this game!

Forum posts on a seriousness scale, don't need to be taken all that serious...but I don't consider how long your guide and posts/replies are as "simple", nor mine for that matter...networking isn't simple sometimes! How do I (or anyone reading this thread) suppose to know how many people you helped? If new replies come up asking for help all the time, it's easy to conclude there's still a lot of help needed out there! Can we move on now? ;-p
Galactic Civilizations III
Reply #53 from Sins Forums Top
I'm still having issues hosting a game, even with the proper ports opened in my Linksys router. I'm assuming it's because of the NAT rules are still in effect. Is there any way to set the rules properly short of either buying a new router or ditching it entirely? Maybe switch to 3rd party firmware?
Reply #54 from Sins Forums Top
I'm still having issues hosting a game, even with the proper ports opened in my Linksys router. I'm assuming it's because of the NAT rules are still in effect. Is there any way to set the rules properly short of either buying a new router or ditching it entirely? Maybe switch to 3rd party firmware?
End of quote



Make sure you're not in a "double-nat" situation (my quide explains what that is). If you are, and are having trouble changing that, contact me....I'll get you on my TS server and we'll get this solved for you.


thanks,

the Monk

Reply #55 from Sins Forums Top
Hey Monk,

I might have missed it in your guide, but how do I know if my cable modem is running as a router?
Reply #56 from Sins Forums Top
Hey Monk,

I might have missed it in your guide, but how do I know if my cable modem is running as a router?
End of quote



Do you have a router besides your cable-modem? If so, check the WAN IP of your router in the "status" page. If it starts with something like 192.xxx.xxx.xxx then yes your cable-modem is also setup to "route" between the internet and you. If you don't have a router besides your cable-modem, check to see what IP your PC has, if it again starts with something like 192.xxx.xxx.xxx then yes your cable-modem is also acting as a router.


the Monk
Reply #57 from Sins Forums Top
I have a netgear WR614v6, just did a check of the "status" and I didn't see a 192 ip address. I'm about at my wit's end here. I have no idea why the game doesn't want me to host. I'm a nice guy, I'd be a great host.

I unplugged the router and plugged the cable modem directly to the PC. IP doesn't start with 192.
Reply #58 from Sins Forums Top
I have a netgear WR614v6, just did a check of the "status" and I didn't see a 192 ip address. I'm about at my wit's end here. I have no idea why the game doesn't want me to host. I'm a nice guy, I'd be a great host.

I unplugged the router and plugged the cable modem directly to the PC. IP doesn't start with 192.
End of quote



All evidence points to your cable-modem not being setup as a router. All you need to do now is forward the ports I've listed to your PC's IP and make sure you've got all of your security software setup with the right "exceptions" or disabled and you'll be able to host.

NOTE: You can host using the Windows Firewall (I have and continue to do so). You will still get the ICO warning message (please read my post #30 in this thread) for more info on the ICO warning message.

If you're still having problems after following my instructions, look me up on xfire and I'll give you the info for my TS Server so that I can walk you through the instructions as they pertain to your specific setup.

the Monk
Reply #59 from Sins Forums Top
See monk, that is what's driving me mad. I'm nearly positive I have the proper ports forwarded, and the right exceptions set up (I've already tried hosting with the firewall turned off and it still gives me that infernal message of failure). That said, I'm sure once I get in touch with you it'll be something really stupid, like I forgot to turn the modem on or something.

Reply #60 from Sins Forums Top
See monk, that is what's driving me mad. I'm nearly positive I have the proper ports forwarded, and the right exceptions set up (I've already tried hosting with the firewall turned off and it still gives me that infernal message of failure). That said, I'm sure once I get in touch with you it'll be something really stupid, like I forgot to turn the modem on or something.

End of quote



Please read my post (#30) on page 1 of this thread for clarification regarding that "ICO Hosting Warning" message.


the Monk
Reply #61 from Sins Forums Top
hi monk,

first off apprecate all the help you are giving everyone here.
i have read and reread your guild and being i have little knowledge when it comes to network topics i did find it hard to understand but from what i have got i need to have it set to OPEN-NAT after going into my router settings (i have the NetGear WGT624v3)i see nothing in any settings about changing NAT restrictions, i just looked on there support website and from what i gather its not supported on that model.
I did a search on how to open-nat and near everything that came up with was for Xbox live.

incase it helps i have my modem connected to my router via ethernet cable and i have my wifes computer connected from the router via ethernet cable as well not sure if this makes any diffrence but just incase.

i have set up the portforwed in there options. and i also used the portforwarding program to set it up.
so assuming that is not the problem

apprecate any help in there matter thanks again
Reply #62 from Sins Forums Top
hi monk,

first off apprecate all the help you are giving everyone here.
i have read and reread your guild and being i have little knowledge when it comes to network topics i did find it hard to understand but from what i have got i need to have it set to OPEN-NAT after going into my router settings (i have the NetGear WGT624v3)i see nothing in any settings about changing NAT restrictions, i just looked on there support website and from what i gather its not supported on that model.
I did a search on how to open-nat and near everything that came up with was for Xbox live.
End of quote


The reason searches about NAT-open/moderate/strict mostly hit on Xbox live is because that is how the Xbox control panel describes it. All of those (open/moderate/strict) are levels of NAT-filtering. NAT-filtering can be being performed by someone's ISP, by their router, or even their third-party firewall/security software.

My NAT explanation is to illustrate that even if ports/traffic are "forwarded" from your router to your PC, and those same ports/traffic are then "allowed" to access your PC (via enabling that in any software firewalls on the PC) the "return" communication to the other player can become ruined by NAT filtering.

Having said that, if your router doesn't allow you to modify the "level" of NAT-filtering it performs (many consumer-model routers do not and some hide it under another name like "gaming mode", one assumes that "gaming mode" will relax NAT-filtering to OPEN) then it most likely relaxes the NAT-filtering in tandem with the act of "forwarding" a port. What I mean is, if your router doesn't have specific NAT-related options it will most likely relax its NAT-filtering for the "forwarded" ports automaticaly, however to what level will be different from router to router.



incase it helps i have my modem connected to my router via ethernet cable and i have my wifes computer connected from the router via ethernet cable as well not sure if this makes any diffrence but just incase.

i have set up the portforwed in there options. and i also used the portforwarding program to set it up.
so assuming that is not the problem

apprecate any help in there matter thanks again
End of quote


Here's what you need to have done in order for everything to work:

1. go to the status page (on your router) and see what it says for internet/WAN IP address. If the address starts with 192.168.xxx.xxx then your internet cable/dsl modem is also functioning as a router and you're (what I described in my guide) in a double-NAT situation. If the address doesn't begin with what I just listed then verify that you've done step 2 and 3.

2. go into the router's "port forwarding" section. Make sure you've forwarded TCP ports 6112 and 6000 to the correct IP address for your computer system (ie. 192.168.xxx.xxx). You can find this address by going to the command prompt on your computer (start > run > cmd ) and typing "ipconfig" and hitting enter.

3. make sure you place exceptions for Sins in ALL of the security software you have. The Windows Firewall plays nice with Sins (I've hosted every game with the Windows Firewall turned on), but Windows Defender, MS Live Onecare and other programs do not. Some people I've helped have had to actually kill the windows processes (see my post #51) for details on which processes to kill before playing Sins.


If you're still having problems implementing my instructions, please contact me via xfire (the1monk) so that I can setup a time for you to meet me on my TeamSpeak server and I'll talk you through these instructions.

thanks,

the Monk
Reply #63 from Sins Forums Top
Well the game keep telling me that "most people wont be able to see your game". I done all the stuff and tested whether port forward correctly - I am net admin myself and know how to configure routers/ firewall, of course including my home one (linksys with ddwrt firmware). I can host CS:S game no problesm for example.
Reply #64 from Sins Forums Top
Well the game keep telling me that "most people wont be able to see your game". I done all the stuff and tested whether port forward correctly - I am net admin myself and know how to configure routers/ firewall, of course including my home one (linksys with ddwrt firmware). I can host CS:S game no problesm for example.
End of quote



I don't suppose you read my post (#30) on page on of this thread?

the Monk

Reply #65 from Sins Forums Top

I don't suppose you read my post (#30) on page on of this thread?

the Monk

End of quote


Ohh my bad. thanks for info!- I dont allow ping on wan side either that is why I got the message!

Reply #66 from Sins Forums Top
I have compiled a more SINS-specific guide from all of the information I've posted to this and various other threads regarding the correct networking setup for SINS-multiplayer.


Click the link below to download it:
WWW Link


the Monk
Reply #67 from Sins Forums Top
oh man...

i've been fighting ports and firewalls and xp services for hours due to Ironclad message "most people will not be able to join your game."

Thanks for the info oin ur link. :-)

holy cow !
Reply #68 from Sins Forums Top
Man Monk, your not into MS Flight SImulator, are you? People over there have been dealing with these exact issues for years now. Several of the groups I've been in could definately have used someone like you.

Great job on these guides and your help here. I just got my system set up, but have not tried it yet to make sure it works. Hope I don't have to bother you with any problems. I am an IT student afterall, I should be able to get it figured out myself.
Reply #69 from Sins Forums Top
Man Monk, your not into MS Flight SImulator, are you? People over there have been dealing with these exact issues for years now. Several of the groups I've been in could definately have used someone like you.

Great job on these guides and your help here. I just got my system set up, but have not tried it yet to make sure it works. Hope I don't have to bother you with any problems. I am an IT student afterall, I should be able to get it figured out myself.
End of quote



Just glad to help!  :D  Feel free to contact me if you need anything.

aside:
Unfortunately my brother is the one into MS Flight Simulator (he's the one of us who's still a pilot - I used to fly helo's sometime back :) ) Before either of us actually flew anything for real, we used to invest hours at a time into Falcon 3.0!

the Monk
Reply #70 from Sins Forums Top
Just wanna praise the topic starter, great info on the whole connection issue.
@the_Monk, keep the good work up!

Since i've battled myself through many hours trying to fix connection problems with games, mostly rts, a while back i came over this website: http://66.134.89.225/~sic/nettest.html which seems to work great, at last in my favor. It doesn't help you in solving your issue, but it can tell you if things are working right or not.
Reply #71 from Sins Forums Top
the_Monk absolutely rocks! THANK YOU so much!
Reply #72 from Sins Forums Top
Question, "SOHO" routers, what does "SOHO" stand for? in your guide, "SOHO" routers are D-link, Netgear, Linksys, etc. But what do "SOHO" stand for really?
Reply #73 from Sins Forums Top
Question, "SOHO" routers, what does "SOHO" stand for? in your guide, "SOHO" routers are D-link, Netgear, Linksys, etc. But what do "SOHO" stand for really?
End of quote


SOHO = small office / home office

In the future I will make an even better attempt at keeping geek-lingo out of my guides!  :) 
Reply #74 from Sins Forums Top
@ Frogboy

No way, you guys rock! Such an AMAZING game, I will be (whenever I find the time..hehe) playing this game for a long time to come. Thank you!
Reply #75 from Sins Forums Top
Hey Monk, I'm one of the guys who chatted in your TS a week ago about the hosting problems. (Remember, I was with the guy who's ISP would stop him from hosting for no real reason). I'd just like to thank you for your help. It took some tinkering but I finally was able to host through the double nat setup I have going. All it took was for me to disable the firewall my modem had built into it so that the ports would be forwarded.

Thanks again man, now I can finally enjoy this great game!