Nazi Earth

So you basically want to make a Nazi as a race? That's cool, I'd play as them at least once.

For the flag, instead of using just the plain swastika, you can use the eagle that sits on a wreath with the swastika inside it, just futurize it with different colors, possibly metallic, and alter the lines and curves to a slightly different style. I think I have a picture on my computer, actually, if I can find it, but I don't know how to get it on this site.

I hate nazi's and I'm very happy that they where beaten, why must you mod them alive? better make a "Coca cola Company" Race which dominates the world *g*^^ (I like coke^^)

Space Coke.....hmmm....tasty

It does sound a little politically incorrect, however Terraner05, with Nazi's as a custom race you could also play AGAINST them, beating them as many times as you want to.

..And you could play as the McDonaldsCocaCola Alliance

All your ships would get sensor and speed bonusses, because your crews
are high on sugar and caffeine. Your military rating would be low however,
because your soldiers are overweight from all the junk food.

I like the idea, when the mod comes out lemme know.

I second Terraners criticism.

Also, keep in mind that this mod probably will face difficulties being approved in the library: In several countries (Germany as the prime example), display of the Swastika is illegal. With offsite mods, no problem, but with the library, Stardock might want to stay on the safe side.

Geez, we just had a nazi themed thread, and that poster saw the error of his ways and changed the details.

People need to realize that just the mention of the word "nazi" invokes some pretty intense emotions in others. There could very well be players on here with first hand experience of the atrocities committed by the Nazi regime.

Please consider others when these very real and touchy subjects come to mind, and please let this idea and thread die, quickly.

I'm sure it will get no where as it would be rejected so why bother with the effort.

Jamius, is this a joke? Are you actively trolling, or do you seriously believe that something glorifying thugs, psychopaths, and mass murderers is acceptable? I don't mean this post as a personal attack, just please think through the ramifications of what you are proposing and the perceptions you create by doing so.

mcdonalds-coca cola Alliance^^



*laughing* interesting thoughts^^ hehe that mod will get a medal from me^^



you're right so, although I'm one of the younger generation, this topic seems not to be undangerous yet, and it still gets a headshaking from me.
I've seen lots of videomaterial of the past of my country in school, and making a nazi earth mod wouldn't let people like me enjoy it.

you probably just can enjoy it when you didn't know too much about it.

I also wouldn't like a planet of Indians and open the option to conquer them.
Pc Games should be free of cruel history in my opinion.

so, I also advise you to forget this mod and read some history books

just a free mind,

Stefan

People don't seem so sqeemish when it comes to Communist imagery though do they?

What of those who play WW2 shooters online, and play as the Nazi's?
While one should not forget what they did, by taking this 'sensitive' attitude, I think you just give the symbols of that regime power over peoples pshyce.

And to be perfectly fair, there is a star of David included for people to use, might this not cause offense to those of the Islamic faith who associate it with Zionism, and their belief that the "zionists" are commiting forms of genocide?
Is there an Islamic associated flag with the game or some of the mods?

My national and racial sensibilities may find the Saint georges cross and Union Jack rascist and symbols of oppression and mass murder.

I say make the mod, put it on the library, if Stardock won't allow it, see if you can put it up elsewhere. Those who want to play as such a "race" can do so, just as those who hate them, can play a game where they can destroy them.

Those people who use their positions to ban such images and attack those who do ask this kind of stuff are in my view being totalitarian themselves. Each to their own, personal freedoms and all that stuff.

neilo just likes to fight with everyone.


as for the mod it is your mod if you want to make it do so. if you want to share try to.

Not at all, in fact i thought my comments were civil, i did not attack anyone. It seems that i do end up at your throat alot though danny, perhaps it's comments like the one above baiting me in to flaming on you....It is past time you read post clearly before commenting on them, i don't mind you jabbing at me, but do it within the facts and topics of the thread in question. No-one is fighting...../sigh\



Good point dragoon, i guess not. Though has any mod/empire been created for GalCiv with a communist theme? I guess the Nazi atrocities are far more scrutinized than the communist ones, i certainly would not like to try and debate who was worse.



These are generally depicting historical events or at the least are based on those events. They are not suggesting that the Earth is under Nazi rule and we have suffered that rule and oppression for many a century.



You make fair points, but it is speculation. The Star of David may cause offense. Granted. Having the Swastika displayed will cause offensive, and IIRC is illegal in many places. Im sure you or the OP are not going to try and say that it is only speculation that the nazi's were evil, vile and ruthless and are hated by the majority.

I think that is where the difference's lie, the nazi's are just a bad choice.

See danny, not fighting, debating, it is what us mature folks do, join in if you can, but do not goad me into a flame war with you. That is just poor form.

I fail to see how placing the Nazis into the game is somehow glorifying them. There are many games that have Nazis in them - from tactical and strategic simulators, to flight simulators and shooters. None of them glorify the Nazi regime. Glorifying them would involve both apologising for their actions and beliefs and protraying those same things in a positive (read: glorious)light. Really, this mod would be no different from books such as Swastika Night and The Man in the High Castle that show a successful Nazi regime. Granted both of those books are instructional, yet they are art/entertainment. Taking offense at Nazies used for entertainment is both silly and too politically correct.

In your opinion.

In my opinion having a mod where you play as a all conquering nazi race that has enslaved humanity is glorifying them.

Um, sorry if I stirred up a hornet's nest..actually I am Jewish by blood so in no way would I want to so-call glorify them... I just like alternate world scenarios thats all. I thought also about Earth-Israel, Communist Earth, etc... I was actually going to create an Israeli Planet (like all Jews came from there...maybe name it Eden...cause sometimes I feel like an alien anyway) and have them combat a Nazi Earth. Again, sorry if I offended anyon with my suggestion. But irregardless of people's block on shoulder approach..I would still like to see the mod... even if it has to be housed off-site. BTW I play Hearts of Iron 2, and in some ways I like to see GAl Civ2 as an extension of that...and in that game...which also sells in Germany... there are the nazi's, but of course no nazi flag..and as a Jew myself...I see those laws as stupid and reminscient of a fearful people. I believe in freedom not oppression...and oppressing certian icons is exactly what the nazi's did... so how are those laws different? I dont know...I dont vote in those countries so I have no say... But as a Jew..I dont fear those symbols at all nor am I offended by them. But, again..sorry if I offended anyone making this suggestion.

Well I hope everyone has learned their lesson. Just kidding, No matter what you do or say in life, you will offend. I do not have a politically correct bone in my body and it gets me in trouble, lots of it. To the point where a company I was working for wanted me to go to sensitivity traing    Guaranteed I would get kicked out. Back to the Nazisim, you will have many that will complain and many that will not. Just please proceed with extreme caution and choose words carefully. Chat later.

No it doesn't. Glorifying the Nazis involves glorifying their past achievements and horrors. Playing space nazis in no way achieves that. That would be like saying playing Axis and Allies, Company of Heroes, Battlefield 1942, Hearts of Iron 1 & 2, etc etc glorifies Nazi Germany.

you mean as opposed to an all conquering human race that has enslaved humanity.

Yeah, sure, but those games are based in a time when Nazis were a threat. It would make no sense at all to remove them, and I doubt even the most "politically correct" (stupid as that term is) person would object. This is a very different case.

As for communism, I don't think that is a fair comparison. The Nazis were a very specific fascist empire that committed many atrocities, whereas communism is just a generic ideology with both good and bad associated with it. Sure, you can say that the Soviet Union committed atrocities, but I don't think the fault can be laid at the feet of communism in general. Rather, they were the fault of specific people like Trotsky and Stalin. Nazism's atrocities, on the other hand, were built-in to its ideology. Big difference between The Communist Manifesto and Mein Kampf, no?

Are you able to dictate to me what offends and what doesn't? You cannot impose your opinions over mine, or anyone else's.

Again you are depicting real world events set in their natural time frame. The two cannot be compared.

The premise of the mod is that the nazi regime was victorious in WWII and continued to spread until it took over the entire world. Given the nazi predisposition to blonde and blue eyed, is it reasonable to assume that those atrocities once contained in Europe would have been implemented across the globe. The nazi regime would have eraticated all before them as they saw fit.

Now fit that into the Galciv context and inline with a mod. Most mod's invariably carry over certain themes from the parent idea. So some buildings one might see would be Slave Labour camps, Gas Chambers, human experimental buildings..etc..

Now using these, which are synonymous with the nazi regime, is glorification.

In my opinion.



The nazi's were human. Give me an example of what you mean.

jamius01, given your background i am surprised that you would want such a mod. I find it hard to accept that you would enjoy playing this game using the nazi race and using the types of buildings and idea's that go hand in hand with the nazi's. EG, using the Genocide technique of invading a planet for instance via gas chambers....

Each to their own i guess. If you do go ahead with the mod, please tread very carefully.

Don't these things already exist in GalCiv2?

I thought all that was proposed here was an emblem and a portrait for diplomacy anyways?

If the player is given control of that empire, then yes we are dealing with glorification. If the Nazis are presented as an unplayable race (enemy), then it is not glorification. However, I find it strange that you aren't advocating the removal of the Korath Clan. Their manners are disturbingly similar to the Nazis techniques to 'purify' the world. I admit that they are fictional, but is not playing a race that desires to annihilate all before it somehow embracing that mindset?




Perhaps I was not clear, or I was misunderstood. The very fact that you are playing the Nazis to win may be taken as a glorifying stance.




I agree that Communism is not inherently evil, but Stalinism is another story. It was a part of Stalin's ideology to massacre millions. Yes, that is Stalin, but it was practiced by nearly the entire state. If GalCiv were to release a mod with Stalin alive and dominating Earth, that would be no different from a mod using Hitler or just Nazism. Hell, even Civilization IV had Stalin.

But at the end of the day, Neilo is correct. This is all about opinions and the modders treading carefully.

Yes i guess they are, but in a fictional sense. As Wilfred points out, the Korath are very similar, but again fictional. I guess there is, for me at least, a great distinction between playing the game based on a heinous regime that had lingering effects on the world, VS, a similar but totally fictional empire.



Was this the original intent of the OP? Under this guise then yes, i would have to agree that playing against them, in my opinion would not be glorification. I still would not use them personally, i feel there are other avenue's to go down but that's me.

Even an unplayable race poses simple legal difficulties. Many WW2-era games have to be modified for the European market to make them legal. Even fictional ones like Wolfenstein. Historical simulations also aren't exempt from this, IL-2 (flight sim) has all swastikas removed from medals and emblems, both Finnish and German.

There is no way to make a race AI only as far as I know, and the OP comment in the first post "it may not necessarily be evil..maybe neutral at best..." leaves me very confused.

Maybe a more appropriate custom race would be the Microsoft Empire led by Commander Gates. It is an evil empire intent on destroying all opposition and enslaving its population. It has huge economic resources and exellent spying capabilities. Allied factions are forced to use the Microsoft Techtree and technologies like the Microsoft JumpWindows(tm) stargate and Microsoft Galactic Messenger(tm).

Then you could have a battle between the McDonalds-CocaCola Alliance and the Microsoft Empire.

  

You forgot the imminent threat posed by the iEmpire. The iEmpire attacks swiftly, using their iNanoships, and show little mercy with their relentless iAdds. They need not kill, their mindless droning is enough to make one capitulate, and the excessive white color used on all their ships is hypnotic.

Their leader iliketheletteri is undeterred in his quest that all beings sway to his iIdeals and only believe that he is right and all should ibow to him.

They are everywhere, beware their iSpy's are well hidden....