Another Day-Another Lie

This is antecdotal and far from a scientific study, but several girls I knew in highschool and college had abortions.

Every single one of them regret it.

Every single one. 

And the women I know who gave their babies up for adoption?  They're just as emotionally damaged.  In a few cases, they're worse.

Yes, I also don't know any who are celebratory about having to abort their child as if they made the right decision.  

I do know of a  young lady who recently gave her child up via adoption.  It's an open adoption and from what I can see and understand it's a win-win for all.  The decision beforehand was excruciating for the very young mother and her family but now she's happy knowing she made the right decision   The baby is thriving in his new environment. 

I do not see what the problem is here. There is no doubt of the right or wrong of it ... IS THERE? If you see some vantage point in stating the obvious, well I don’t see it. I am sure the people you reference and their ilk can supply just as many examples in support of their warped arguments as you can … it does not matter. All you end up doing is stoking fires and fighting with them (kind of like me) and there is no need for that nonsense at all.

In order to seriously (come on) have this discussion; YOU have to accept the PRECONDITION that there is some merit in there ‘warped minds’ in order to be able to argue with them. I will not allow them that stipulation and therefore do not place any stock in there excuses … We all are right and they are wrong … end of story.

All I saw was complaining … nothing about what can be done … even though it seems to be out of our hands right now … we do still have to do more than just complain, right?

KFC

Didn't mean to sound so sharp, it is just so simple for me to decide FIRST if there is merit, and if I do not find any, I try NOT to allow myself to be emotionally drawn into a fight because that is all you will find there.

Of course there is misery, death and destruction and people are crushed on both sides of the 'argument': But I thought the issue of abortion was the actual topic.

Ah, therein is the difference.  I don't know anyone who did an open adoption, but that actually makes sense.  I'm curious what the little girl (13) next door is going to do.  Right now she plans on keeping the baby, but her 13 year old boyfriend's (and babydaddy's) family are in a much better poistion to raise the child.  She doesn't know it yet, but they plan on suing for sole custody.

In her case, because she plans to keep it, I don't see any win-win.  This is going to be painful all round.  And to make matters worse, her Grandpa died over the weekend (lung cancer).  I don't know what they're going to do....

Thanks for the article and bringing the link to our attention and giving it this apt title.

Lies and lying propaganda that supports them keep the abortion pot boiling and the abortion industry rolling in the big bucks. That is what all these lies are really about.

These particular lies not only in the UK but all over the world have been spewed for quite some time.

yes, Lula.  I remember reading the history of how the whole Roe Vs. Wade decision was made by the lady that was used as their test case.  She never ended up having her abortion and was tossed aside like garbage once the pro-abortion people got their decision.   Norma McCorvey went on to work in abortion clinics afterwards for a while and later wrote about how the whole thing was founded on a lie as she exposed one lie after another. 

I agree. Seen this before.  It doesn't work.   The girl I wrote about picked out and met the adoptive parents after going over many applicants.   While in the hospital she changed her mind because the nurse brought the baby in to her to nurse (they messed up) and that was that. 

So she brought the baby home to her mom's and the adoptive parent's dismay.  A month or two later she changed her mind when she realized how much work this was going to be.  Now because the adoption is open she'll be able to get updates of his well-being and I think visit him from time to time. 

sooooo exactly what are you trying to say BT?  Are you actually (gasp) on our side of the fence on this one? 

Why do I have to accept anything from their "warped minds" to be able to argue with them?  Who says I want to argue?   I try to make it a point NOT to argue with someone with a warped mind because what good will it do besides take up valuable time that could be used elsewhere? 

[quote]Tell that to the thousands of women who have aborted their babies and lived to tell about it. Many of them are seen marching for life every January either at their state capitols or in Washington warning others NOT to abort their unborn children like they did. It was the trauma and guilt that pressed them to participate in these marches. [/quote]

Exactly. Many of these women belong to the campaign www.SilentNoMoreAwareness.org.

They also participate in the march and tell their stories exposing the abortion industry lies. They know for sure taht abortion has a negative side that is being hidden, denied and lied about.  

Some childbirths end in death for the child, or the parent or sometimes both.  Every abortion ends in the death of one of them.  Simple mathematics indicates abortion is a lot more dangerous to life. 

Lulu:

“sooooo exactly what are you trying to say BT?  Are you actually (gasp) on our side of the fence on this one?” Lulu, I do not have any fences, you do as you have just stated. You and I have already had this discussion (or was it Lulu?) and you already know I do not believe in infanticide so this is nothing but a dig at me, silly girl. Real righteous of you.

BoobzTwo:

“In order to seriously (come on) have this discussion; YOU have to accept the PRECONDITION that there is some merit in there ‘warped minds’ in order to be able to argue with them.”  It just seems straight forward to me. ????

Lulu:

Why do I have to accept anything from their "warped minds" to be able to argue with them?  Who says I want to argue?   I try to make it a point NOT to argue with someone with a warped mind because what good will it do besides take up valuable time that could be used elsewhere?  

1. I said you should not accept them or their arguments, so you and your anger are alone here.
2. You told me yourself (or was it KFC?) that you enjoy a good argument.
3. I am one of those warped minds you do not want to argue with … care to look at my previous articles?
4. I have been trying to tell yous guys that you have been wasting my time, but that did not denture you either did it.
5. So no, I do not think you are practicing Christianity here; you are being spiteful and hateful, so sad.
6. You have to use your eyes to see properly, not your anger, IMO.

Lulu, sorry, supposed to be KFC in my last post.

BT posts:

 From the link KFC provided, we see the problem is that the pro-abortion advocates are spewing lies for the consumption of the general public.

We know it is lies becasue of common sense (pregnancy is natural and abortion is a violent act) and as DRG points out by simple math.

One vantage point is that it's always good to get info like this out....by sharing it with us on JU. We in turn may share it with others. Also, it's a learning curve...there are X number of people who may read this and not have ever known about it otherwise.

Actually they can't give examples in support of their agrument that giving birth is more hurtful to women than abortion, so they lie.

If one is pro-life ...his/her goal is to win the fight to end abortion on demand and restore protection to the innocent baby in the womb. Exposing pro-abortion warped arguments (lies) always matters.

today my bible study teacher said "if a lie gets a head start, it's hard for the truth to catch up." 

to which I said in a written note I passed him later... "BUT the truth always rises to the top because the best friend of truth is time." 

Eventually this will all get sorted out.  The truth always prevails. 

Lulu:

If one is pro-life ...his/her goal is to win the fight to end abortion on demand and restore protection to the innocent baby in the womb. Exposing pro-abortion warped arguments (lies) always matters.

I wasn't talking about the morality, only the stupidity. The truth is that they can make arguments to support their morbid policies ... as evidenced by the appalling numbers of abortions. And you can bet they, the monsters will argue with you and tell you all about your lies …???. So we all sit around and argue why everyone else is wrong. Might as well pound your head into a wall (I speak from experience, hehehe).

This to me is just posturing and to what ends besides arguments I cannot see.  If you want to actually be constructive, I would think organizations like “Planned Parenthood” (and a gazillion others I suppose) should be if not shutdown, to at least attempt to shut down their funding. It is amazing how many things just go away when the $’s are removed from the arguments.  I guess I am pragmatic in matters where the opposition has no moral standing and I just refuse to allow them a foothold at the table … you do not think they are going to be convinced of anything you say do you ... as long as they have the $’s and Government support?

My suggestion would be to stop patting yourselves on the back … and DO SOMETHING … other than discuss (seemingly amongst yourselves only?) the merits and the right of it … You cannot win the battle if all you are willing to is talk … and who do you think all your exposing matters to … them???

KFC:

Here you go with the truth again. I don't know if you have noticed, but the truth seems to be losing most of the arguments today. But you seem to be happy waiting for the end of mankind to prove your truth. I prefer to do something about it now, because it is a moot point when all of us are gone. You cannot win the fight if all you do is talk about it.

Lula posts:

Okay.

However, I would posit that in the case of abortion, it's always about  morality.

And that's why I thought you were speaking of it in terms of morality when you said:

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Yes, for sure they can make arguments to support their morbid (abortion) policies. In this case, it's

but the question and job before us is to determine whether or not this pro-abortion argument is truth or a lie?

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Re: the highlighted. By "you" here, I take that to mean the pro-life side lies.

If that is so, then please tell  tell me exactly what are the pro-life side's lies?

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Actually, on the subject of abortion, the truth is prevailing..the pro-life movement is winning the fight to end abortion on demand. 

Look at the ever-growing involvement of young people in all aspects of the culture of life and how they are speaking up.

Look at the direction of conversions ....they are going from pro-abortion to pro-life. I'm thinking of Abby Johnson..Have you read her book, UNplanned"? How many former pregnancy resource center directors or workers have repented of saving babies and are now pro-abortion? It just doesn't happpen, does it?

How about the tidal wave of women who regret their abortion publically speaking out? This puts the abortion advocates in quite a dilemna. 

Killing babies in the womb is a bloody business. How about the fact that abortuaries (clinics) are closing all over the country.  

How about the fact that legal evidence is mounting that the Roe vs. Wade decision was wrong and that more and more people are recognizing that the personhood of the unborn child be accorded with rights and protections of our US Constitution.

As for the truth, what about the growing mountain of medical, psychological and sociological evidence that abortion harms women, men and families? The arguments from medicine, science, psychology, sociology, law, ethics, and religion all support the culture of life..ie the pro-life view.

Sorry about the way the quotes came out in my last post.

Lulu:

I guess I am just going to have to stop using question marks too. All things considered, I suppose it is only natural you would (disregard everything I told you at least 3 times now, AGAIN) and take anything from me, in this light, go figure.

I am tired of your truth of truths … we are talking about human beings being murdered here … and you just want to be TRUE! I do not study abortion either … the act is all I need. I will grant you all you have said here (like I have a choice); just answer me this one question: With all your pursuits and endeavors … Why is the abortion rate increasing? You better try harder or differently.

How do you always figure out my devilish plots to subvert you … You are amazing … consistancy is your way right?

Nothing wrong with the quotes, just the way you looked at them???



We are talking about human beings being murdered here IS not only my truth of truths, but the unversal truth of truths.

I surely do...glad you noticed. Shouldn't every one want to be true?

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Correct, the abortion rate has increased amongst teenage age girls up to 19.

Any objective person can only conclude taht the rise in abortion rates amongst this age group is becasue they are encouraged to be sexually active through institutionalized K-12th grade classroom Sex-Ed instruction innocuously disguised as "Health Education".  Planned Parenthood and its allies, a coalition of financially vested advocacy organizations, develop the Sex-Ed curriculum, teach the teachers the curriculum, provide the literature, books, videos, condoms, etc.

These organizations are the forces behind promoting so called responsible sexual behavior. The goal is not to discourage these girls from being sexually active, but to teach them how, when and where to acquire and use contraceptives . Abortion is discussed as an aspect of birth control.

Who gains when these girls become sexually active and when the so-called 'safe-sex' approach doesn't work? It would be PP and its allies wouldn't it?

Can you see what's happening here? PP and these very organizations have a whopper of a financial vested  interest in keeping these girls sexually active and when they become pregnant abortion results. 

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Lulu: Yes I can!!! But I am not the one that needs convincing ... and neither are you ...

All I am trying to point out is the fact that we are losing the battle; come on, use your God given head. If things are not advancing in the proper direction (as we all agree they are not), then maybe you need to refocus on technique used (with the desired results themselves of prime concern), and stop pressing theology. People find it difficult at best to compete with perfectness (of which they are incapable of anyway), and they have actually been known to listen to reason … if given the chance? STOP trying to make Christians out of everyone and concentrate on making them human … again.

... Stating the obvious accomplishes nothing ... one step at a time, as we all learned  from birth.

see that's where you don't get it BT being an atheist and all.  That's EXACTLY what we do need.  Theology is nothing but (Theos means God/ology means study of) the study of God. 

Maybe if we did it HIS way, we'd see how well it would work.  We've been doing it OUR way for so long.  No wonder we're all messed up.  So like Dr. Phil asks... "how's it working for ya?" 

 Christians CAN'T make other Christians.  It's impossible.  Doesn't happen like that.  We're not the ones that are giving birth.  It's God's job, not ours. 

KFC:

Excrete or get off the pot ... At what point in your righteousness are you going to stop concentrating on the REAL TRUTH … and concentrate on the actual truth … You are losing this battle … and I am not the enemy! And if Christians cannot make other Christians (it doesn’t work that way, it’s impossible?), why do you spend a majority of your time trying to doing so?

... being an atheist and all ...

what's the difference? 

Oh..and I do not claim to be a righteous person btw.  Next to God, even my best righteous moment is but filthy rags to Him. 

it's not my battle to lose and you are, biblically speaking, the enemy.  There is no fellowship between light and darkness.  Light dispels the darkness.  There is no fellowship between oil and water.  They do not mix well.  It's the same with the converted and the unconverted.  It's a spiritual matter. 

Why do you say that I am?  Because I speak from a biblical worldview?  That means I'm trying to make Christians?  Well that would be like saying you're trying to birth atheists.  It's a double sided argument.  You see thru the lens of humanism and I see thru the lens of scripture. 

I have No power to "make Christians."   It's the job of the Holy Spirit to open hearts and minds.  Not mine.