Advent Progenitor Cap fails to use abilty

from Stardock Forums

I realise that most people use this cap only to conquer planets early and thus the shield regen ability doen't get used too often....  However when it is used this ability is useless!  The AI for the ship doesn't EVER seem to use the ability unless the ship has been "crushed" already.  It should work in such a way that once the shields drop below 50% the ability should fire....  it doesn't... so you'd think once your shield are down it would fire... it doesn't.... so you'd think once your ship is severely damaged it would fire.... it doesn't.... to me these should be automatic points to use the ability.   And yes, the ships DO have enough anti-matter to use the ability but simply DO NOT!  Very frustrating! I hate how I have to micro manage this ability!

Oh, the one other time this ability should be used is once combat has ended!  The Cap should be using this ability to restore its shields ASAP once battle is done not go sit around waiting for normal recovery!   Heck even if just this much was added to the AI it would make the ability somewhat useful. 

24,249 views 13 replies
Reply #1 from Sins Forums Top

Make sure you don't turn off the auto-cast. It's set to go off after a bit of shield damage, and has worked fine for me in my last game.

 

:fox:

Reply #2 from Sins Forums Top

 

Welcome to the Sins community.  It's a really great game.

Since it is a capital ship you might want to keep a close eye on it and just micromanage the use of its abilities.  Also, you could use it while it's out colonizing and fighting militias; it will help restore the shields on the frigates you brought along to help fight alongside your Mothership (along with the mothership's shields).  As a general rule, the AI does an awful job with using capital ship abilities, so that's something that you should plan to control directly.  (Actually, the AI does a poor job doing just about everything compared to what a human can do.)

Shield Restore is one of the most useful capital ship abilities in the game and part of what makes the Progenitor Mothership one of the game's best capital ships.  As Advent, it should almost always be your first capital ship.  Pros who play competitive online multiplayer use the Progenitor and the shield restore ability very heavily.  A common upgrade route for the Progenitor is:  Level 1--colonize.  Level 2--shield.  Level 3--colonize.  Level 4--shield.  Level 5--shield or colonize depending on whether it's time to fight or whether the cap will keep colonizing open planets.  (Exception-- if you play online multiplayer and you plan to use a scout/light frigate spam strategy and/or you anticipate that your opponent is going to try that against you then you might prefer a Halcyon carrier capital ship.  However, I still prefer the Mothership for my first capital ship.)  Shield restore is also very useful in combination with Guardians which can absorb 33% of the damage your other ships are taking and apply it to its shields.  (Mothership shield restore of your Guadians' shields is part of the Advent's synergy.)

Advent is a great race to specialize in, by the way.  An experienced and competent Advent opponent who has put together a "battle ball" is hard to stop.

 

Ashes of the Singularity II
Reply #3 from Stardock Forums Top

hmmm that wierd even after battle the ship still use Shield Gen to recover lost shields  and i dont turn auto cast off tho i do notice the AI will fire it off when it has full shields ?!?!?!? i own use it the clear planets then it takes a back seat to the Guardians

Reply #4 from Sins Forums Top

I rarely have any abilities on autocast. The autocast AI just doesn't know how to use them. Shield regen should have the max amount of ships possible within the radius, for example. Same with Missile barrage, etc. The Advent microing of abilities gets pretty intense though. You pretty much are just using abilities constantly, late in a game.

Reply #5 from Sins Forums Top

 You just have to micro captial ships to the max. The capitial ship is bascily  a hero unit in a game like Warcraft 3. They are to say "special." Plus the game wants you to command the ships, not leave the AI to do it. Always leave the autocast on unless you need to save antimatter. Also you have to keep a watch on the fleet and if you find it's not working, click on the abillty and click on the ship you want to use it on. That's what I did with my heavily damaged Raidiance. ( it still died though during the dangerous preparing for phase jump.) But shield restoration is very important. It kept the battleship alive long enough to tak down another captial ship with it and like a dozen frigates. ( and the enemy captial ship had higher level)

Reply #6 from Sins Forums Top

One thing to keep in mind about Shield Restore - it is channeled, so if you tell it to do anything besides, it'll stop casting.

About hating micro - you should speak w/my best friend, who thinks in very much the same terms. :P

Reply #7 from Sins Forums Top

get used to micro-ing with advent, it's a micro heavy race.

Reply #8 from Sins Forums Top

spefcial!!! Dey Spefcial!!!

Reply #9 from Stardock Forums Top

Just to confirm... The autocast NEVER fires off the Shield Regen ability.  I have confirmed this even to the point of turning off all other autocasts and with full reserves of AM the ship never once used this ability right to its very destruction....

Look I am fine with a little microing, but some basic things like expecting the ship to actually use an ability set on autocast is not too far fetched is it?

Reply #10 from Sins Forums Top

The autocast NEVER fires off the Shield Regen ability
End of quote

Yes, it does, just not very intelligently.  It will usually wait for multiple nearby ships to be damaged before it does so.  I'm not surprised that it fails to do so just to save itself.

For most situations, I never turn on autocast.  Sometimes it's good enough, most often it does not.

Reply #11 from Stardock Forums Top

OK so autocast is then only concerned with the fleets shields and not its own preservation???  Dang odd coding there!

I understand many like to micromanage, but I do like to be able to setup a little automation for the more mundane tasks.... the way I was planning to use the ability is now useless.... 

Poor unit AI is tolerable, but poor command AI is just unacceptable in a modern rts....  Maybe increase the AI would over load too many "common" computers and slow the game to a crawl or something... dunno... but self preservation would seem a logical part of any capital ship AI...  Just venting I guess...  sp if your cap ship happens to be alone, or left with only a small rag tag fleet its best ability becomes nearly useless unless you micomange..... OK colonize with the reduced planetary costs is nice too....

I don't mind AI being stupid so long as its logical I guess.... and predictable!

Reply #12 from Sins Forums Top

Just last night I was playing a game, doing my standard fast expansion with a Progenitor.  It reached level 2 and I added my first point to shield restore.  Before I could turn off autocast (a reflex whenever I add to new abilities) it had already used the ability.  So yes, it does use the ability even if only to heal itself.

 

its best ability becomes nearly useless unless you micomange....
End of quote

Admittedly it's not too difficult to line up your ducks and hit this ability every few seconds.

Shield regeneration is possibly one of the most powerful abilities in the game.  Its autocast AI is at very least better than malice, which will waste antimatter targetting small groups (3 or 4) of enemy units.  Better to be overly conservative than too liberal with the application and not have enough antimatter left over for when it counts.

Reply #13 from Sins Forums Top

OK so autocast is then only concerned with the fleets shields and not its own preservation??? Dang odd coding there!
End of quote

The "concern for fleet's shields" is actually what you should be most concerned about.  This is what makes this ship one of the best support caps in the game.  Try it in a battle.  Keep all of your other ships near the progen, watch their shields, and hit shield restore (MANUALLY) when needed.  If you can master this and some other techniques you'll be a good Advent player.  Screw shield recharging an individual ship - recharging your whole fleet is where it's at.

Shield restore is especially vital when you have iconus guardians in your fleet.