Pirates - A way too easy win

Pirates simple strategy

from Sins Forums
Firstly, this is a great game. My one complaint is pirates. Not that they bother me, but that they make winning way too easy.

If I was going to write a strategy guide for SINS it will be one paragraph long. Here it is:

"Watch the Pirate timer. Make sure you have funds before timer runs out. Always, always, always win the bounty bidding war and never ever have pirates attack you. You will win the AI on any difficultly setting, all the time".

I know that since I’ve discovered this, I have yet to lose a game. Keep my enemies killing each other and let the AI deal with pirates.

I mean, can this really be that easy? Does anybody out there agree with me?

I’ve read forums here about strategies to fend off pirates, build defenses on phase lanes, etc. Why bother. Just out bid to make them attach your enemies. It is much easier to spend credits to make pirates attach enemies then credits on pirate phase lane defenses and micro-managing your fleet to fight off pirates.

I hope they come out with a patch to make pirates less powerful. They should be a mosquito-type annoyance as opposed to a sure way to win any game.
Or better yet, make options to disable the bounty bidding war and have pirates attack at random on their own discretion. Or an option to take them out altogether.

Pirates don’t fit in to the theme/look of the game anyway. I mean, it’s the future, with tech and light travel like never before and you got pirates, with spikes/crossbones who say things like "Arrrr". I mean really, if a SINS expansion comes out with player controlled boarding battles, will we see peg legs, eye patches and shoulder parrots on the crew of these ships.

Any thoughts?


strategy
34,799 views 67 replies
Reply #1 from Sins Forums Top
Well... the pirates are easy to beat. So against somebody that knows what they are doing. That strat of yours is useless.
Reply #2 from Sins Forums Top
Any thoughts?
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Old news. Get in line. We don't care. Look up one of the GAZILLION OTHER THREADS on this.
Galactic Civilizations III
Reply #3 from Sins Forums Top
I use the pirates to level my capital ships up while the enemy waste money sending me free exp 0_0

Though i 'do' agree that pirates are an important part of the games strategy, and that learning how to interact with them is important.

I usually do buy them off the first couple attacks while im getting things set up, for example.
Reply #4 from Sins Forums Top
The other threads are about beating the pirates... not complaining about winning through them.

I would keep faith that the AI will improve and as it does the pirates will become less effective, in addition you can play without pirates.

As for them making sense, if you read the material they do make sense... the TEC was for the past 1000 years a band of non-combatants, with no strong central authority or military, each planet was responsible for its own defense. Thus some planets were very susceptible to raids on their commerce, and others would seek a covert way of attacking their rival planets/companies trade markets... pirates would form in no time. Largely because of the effectiveness of said technology and the complete lack of centralized law enforcement.

Pirates exist even today, but as the world consolidates and globalizes they become increasingly scarcer... when the war with the Vasari and Advent is over you can bet the TEC will focus and destroy the various pirate forces before their centralized authority dissipates as the various worlds seek independence again.

Unless they don't of course. Then its time for the Galactic Empire...
Reply #5 from Sins Forums Top
"Or better yet, make options to disable the bounty bidding war and have pirates attack at random on their own discretion"

I'd like this option. I'd prefer random pirate attacks - less predictable or controllable.

It's kind of funny how the pirates can have such an amazingly strong planet, all those ships, and amazing organization.
Reply #6 from Sins Forums Top
the AI in the early game seems very susceptible to pirate attacks. but any PLAYER that knows what there doing when it comes to pirates can shrug them off without even blinking.
Reply #7 from Sins Forums Top
the only part i like about the pirates other then they are a great way to level cap ships is that twords the end of the game when the pirate base has 100+ ships in it its way to much fun to sind my fleet in and watch the pirates explode one after another
Reply #8 from Sins Forums Top
I've had a game recently where the other team made it their goal in life to pool their funds and send the pirates after me. Even with the Vasari Xenophobia tech researched to the max, there just way too many of them, and I had to keep a bulk of my early game fleet at home, lest I lost my sole Volcanic planet, which happened to be right next to the base. It was a strange map becaues there were way more Ice planets, so that one Volcanic one was real important.

I ended up incurring the wrath of my teammates, because as one was falling, I was dealing with pirates, and they're like "Ignore them come help us!" And I'm like "But crap! This is a severe raid! My Volcanic colony is already at 2000/6000 and they've only been here a minute! I need that metal!"

Eventually, I got so ticked I attacked the base when I got heavy cruisers. It was a high loss battle, but I won and captured their little "planet" dealy. Too bad the game lagged (or maybe I was kicked for fighting the darn pirates all the time). By the time it was over I had first in everything and was primed to help my allies in the next star system.

Anyway, I think they should be toned down a bit--the no shields helps, but do they always have to have all Kodiak Battlecruisers? Give them less of those, more variety in their ships, but in such a fashion as to decrease their effectiveness at all raid severity levels.
Reply #9 from Sins Forums Top
Pirates don't have shields, or shield mitigation, so they go down really really fast to focused fire.
Reply #10 from Sins Forums Top
I always want the pirates to attack me as they feed my caps and give me levels, they aren't a serious threat unless you are pretty bad at the game.
Reply #11 from Sins Forums Top
the only use for them is early in the game, in fact, it can be devastating if you drop 5k on pirates early in the game and have them invade in good force. It leaves you low on cash of cause but i have seen those invasions destroy planet of enemy and rebuilding is a lot more then that. Once your front planets have full compliment of defenses though, they become a cap ship exp food :)
Reply #12 from Sins Forums Top
Ehh, in that one map where you start without a home planet, 1 capital ship and 1 turret was enough to kill all ~10-12 pirate vessels.
Reply #13 from Sins Forums Top
Sorry, I should have mentioned my pirate complaint is just for single player AI. Obviously Multiplayer stratigies would be different.
Reply #14 from Sins Forums Top
My complaint is really that the singleplayer Ai, even on hard, is way to easy to win by simpling winning pirate bounty bids and have pirates and my enemies eat each other.

Example, last night, on hard, just kept pirates attacking AI. When I went in wiht my fleet to start my destruction, pirates had decimated most of my opponent and I was laft with nothing but clean-up. Way too easy.
Reply #15 from Sins Forums Top

One capital ship and a few frigates can take care of pirates pretty easily, especially on a planet with decent defenses.

I usually don't even bother to bid against pirates. I welcome pirate raids as I use them to level up my capital ships. Once a capital ship is up to say level 4 or 5 I cycle in a new capital ship and repeat with the new one.

Reply #16 from Sins Forums Top
Yes, this about the AI being succeptible about pirate atacks I think its true. In a game where I went to explore one star I found that there was only one opponent and the pirats (1 pirat base per star it seems) so the opponent were extermined long ago becouse there were even planets yet to colonize there. Another thing, it seems none AI are arranged to never atack the pirat base direcly, so that they can least all the game or till the player decide to put them off, so the binding get to exist till the player wants. This also might get AI a hard time since they never can destroy the pirats. Is just constant trouble for their defenseless planets (AI too have few defenses in their planets, even late game). Guess if its like the orinal poster say then producers need to find a away to AI counter the pirats.
Reply #17 from Sins Forums Top
Yeah, with the exception of the first game or two I've played, Pirates have always been annoyances at worst, and free exp at best. Usually the latter in most cases.

Their ships let you level up your cap ships nice and quick, especially once you mosey on over to their base and stomp a few new mudholes in them.
Reply #18 from Sins Forums Top

One capital ship and a few frigates can take care of pirates pretty easily, especially on a planet with decent defenses.


I usually don't even bother to bid against pirates. I welcome pirate raids as I use them to level up my capital ships. Once a capital ship is up to say level 4 or 5 I cycle in a new capital ship and repeat with the new one.


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Jeez. Brad, could you actually read the post? The problem is the AI and how easy is to beat it with pirated, not the pirates against you.
Reply #19 from Sins Forums Top
In my opinion pirates are almost fine as they are, but I have two tweaks:
1. Why do pirates bring siege equipment along? What do they gain from it? They are there for the trade-ships and the bounty, so why bother with the planet population? Pirates shouldn't siege.
2. Pirates should jump out when they have achieved their goal.
Why should the pirates stay in an almost empty system finishing off research centers when they know you'll be jumping in your main battle fleet within a couple of minutes? Pirates should attack trade-ships, collect the bounty, destroy and raze the trade port and then get their scurvy behinds out of there before the player unleashes the fair justice they deserve upon them.

That way pirates harass your economy and at least look as if what they followed some sort of sensful strategy. They won't be a game-deciding factor anymore, but rather the ounce that tips the balance of the war to your favor in a stalemate.
Reply #20 from Sins Forums Top
vain

1. Since they are like assassins for rent, they should have all equipment to fufill their renters wishes and when they pay bounty to atack they are supposed to atack at best, if not there was no reason to pay them. I guess you can also tell them to atack planets? but neither way it seems logic in my opinon.
About 2. has it is, you tell them to atack a target, it is like they made that fleet just for the annoyance, till death atack. Like their renters bought that fleet. Though taking into consideration the lives inside the ships, I agree they should run like the others. Guess, since their fllet are always kind of small, if they should consider the defenses there they would never atack. Smart, but much more annoying, would be make their inteligence to atack much defenseless planets avoid the others at best if possible, becouse they all come to the same old planet with defenses arranged for them. In my games theu generally only change between atacking 2 planets becouse they are more close, even trough there was a free way to get to others without defenses.
Reply #21 from Sins Forums Top
Well, basically, what you said is exactly the issue I'm going at.
I don't treat the pirates as an independant force, I use them as a cheap replacement distraction-force. I spend up to 2000 credits and the pirates in turn eliminate a random planet of the enemy, or at least cause him to withdraw his main battle fleet to save it.
I don't think that should be what the pirates are about. They should move in, strike swiftly, collect as much bounty as possible, plunder some tradeship and then set off with the booty to spend it on even more pirate-vessels and cheap rum.

Right now pirates are some sort of harassment-eBay-auction. I could just as well spend the bounty on a harassment-fleet myself. The only deciding factor is wether the necessary bounty is bigger than the cost of the regular fleet. I'd much rather like to see some sort of sense implemented into the pirates so they develop their own dynamics, like collecting bounty and investing it into ships and upgrades to make collecting bounty in the future easier. Until then pirates are a failed concept to me.
Reply #22 from Sins Forums Top
I spend up to 2000 credits

Right now pirates are some sort of harassment-eBay-auction. I could just as well spend the bounty on a harassment-fleet myself.
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thing is ... you couldn't "just as easily" build a harassment fleet yourself at that price. not for 2000 credits and not to mention it costs credits + resources to build attack ships. my last game on a 1000 cred bounty i won i spotted the pirate raid that was sent against the AI. i counted approx 12 ships. imagine 12 attack ships for 1000 creds that is crazy mathematics and imbalanced.

the original poster is right on the money. its not about "ohh i can beat the pirate raid look at my defenses" but how you basically criple the AI by sending fleet after fleet of pirates at him.



Reply #23 from Sins Forums Top
I second the OP. Quite often you don't even have to spend 2000 credits per raid. I have quite successfully kept the bidding to 500-1000 credits until well into the mid-game by which time I've kept the desired target busy and slowed down their expansion considerably for me to move in and finish.

They really are also extreme bang for buck. Even after exhausting the bounty on a 500 credit bid, they will stick around and do at least 3 x that amount in damage.

You know those silly "missions" that the AI players demand from you? Give Credits 1000? I'd rather pay the pirates, and I get my money's worth too.
Reply #24 from Sins Forums Top
Its not about the force of the pirate's attack, its the knowledge that they will tie up your fleet for a certain amount of time to keep you from expanding at a rapid rate.

Its also a good way to punish people for overexpanding. There's also multiple strategies to attack at the same time the pirates are to divide your opponent's fleet.

Whoever says they're useless isnt thinking hard enough.
Reply #25 from Sins Forums Top

Its not about the force of the pirate's attack, its the knowledge that they will tie up your fleet for a certain amount of time to keep you from expanding at a rapid rate.

Its also a good way to punish people for overexpanding. There's also multiple strategies to attack at the same time the pirates are to divide your opponent's fleet.

Whoever says they're useless isnt thinking hard enough.
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I agree with this one. Basically the pirates are an "ally for hire" and a lot cheaper than the AI's at that.