Some AI aren't using thier resources

from Sins Forums
So I have noticed this in a couple of games, multiple AIs set to normal and random stance, and when you examine the graphs at the end of the game, it's clear several of the AI seemingly did nothing with the resources they gathered. The graph showing available Metal, Credits, and Crystal constantly rose with no dips as if they were not spending anything. Graphs of ships, techs, and planetary development showed them to be far behind due to lack of expenditure.

There also was a direct correlation between these AIs that stockpile massive amounts of resources and don't spend them and which AIs end up getting crushed first (hint...it was them). I don't know why the AI is doing that but I have seen it in several games now by examining the end game graphs. I will try and post some screenies of the graphs that I am talking about when I am at home.

26,233 views 11 replies
Reply #1 from Sins Forums Top
I noticed this also. I just assumed it was because I was playing on easy. The AI was waaaay behind me in tech and it was my very first game, so I think something is wrong here.
Reply #2 from Sins Forums Top
Did you check that they had all three resources (cash, metal, crystal) in a recent game I played the AI had vast reserves of crystal (30000) but a metal income which wasnt enough to spend the crystal as fast as they gathered it so they built up enormous reserves of crystal. I dont think the AI is aware it can sell one resource, get cash, and buy another.
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Reply #3 from Sins Forums Top
Were you looking at the graph of total accumulated or total available?
Reply #4 from Sins Forums Top
In many games, the A.I. comps (usually beyond the easiest levels) get "cheat" privileges from the game designers : such as free resources, free buildings, free military units.

I do not know in what precise measure that is the case with Sins.

Let's suppose, for example, that the comps get free ships at a regular interval. They would not, then, have to spend resources to obtain them, and that would affect the graphs.

A stable graph might not necessarily mean that the comps don't like spend : it might signify that they are regularly receiving pre-coded freebies -- they don't need to spend!

On another thread, a gamer complained that it happened to him that an almost beaten A.I. could inject massive amounts of credits to outbid him in the pirate-bounty screen. In that case, either the comp had a huge reserve of credits because he did not have to spend credits to get free stuff, or/and he regularly received big bonuses of cash -- or even, that weakened comps get unfair, emergency funds to keep fighting on.

I don't know what is the A.I.-cheat situation with Sins, but I do know that the Galactic Civilization series prides itself in offering many levels of A.I. skill, without giving the comps any cheat or bonus -- those privileges only appearing at the very highest of the many levels of A.I. difficulty.

At the moment, Sins only offers 3 levels : easy, normal, hard. I suspect that the A.I. "cheats" on normal and hard.
Reply #5 from Sins Forums Top

Were you looking at the graph of total accumulated or total available?
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Both, in the total accumulated we were about even, meaning that he was colonizing and bringing in a comparable amount of resources to my empire, but in the total available he had wayyyy more than I did, coupled with a lack of planetary development or ship building means he isn't doing a thing other than colonizing.


Did you check that they had all three resources (cash, metal, crystal) in a recent game I played the AI had vast reserves of crystal (30000) but a metal income which wasnt enough to spend the crystal as fast as they gathered it so they built up enormous reserves of crystal. I dont think the AI is aware it can sell one resource, get cash, and buy another.
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He had a ton of all three, and your right, the AI is almost completely oblivious of the black market for the most part, very little sold off, very little bought.

In many games, the A.I. comps (usually beyond the easiest levels) get "cheat" privileges from the game designers : such as free resources, free buildings, free military units.

I do not know in what precise measure that is the case with Sins.

Let's suppose, for example, that the comps get free ships at a regular interval. They would not, then, have to spend resources to obtain them, and that would affect the graphs.

A stable graph might not necessarily mean that the comps don't like spend : it might signify that they are regularly receiving pre-coded freebies -- they don't need to spend!
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But if the AI is cheating, and getting freebies, then they aren't showing up on the graphs. Take for example the free ships, they would show up in the ship/fleet section of the graph, but unless the freebies aren't tracked in the graph, the aren't getting them because the total number of ships for these dead beat AI stay very low.
Reply #6 from Sins Forums Top
This AI doesn't cheat.
Reply #7 from Sins Forums Top
I've never had the AI 'break' like that before, perhaps it's some sort of strange bug where they forget to actually play.
Reply #8 from Sins Forums Top
Well, depend on how many terrirtory they own. I know by the time I have about 6 planets my money never dip below 70000$.

Research is a tag slow and with the fleet cap there is a limit to how you can build. Given the current AI tactic (exremely conservative in attacking and defense) it's easy to understand they don't constanly using their resource.
Reply #9 from Sins Forums Top
Currently the AI doesn't cheat. I'm 90% sure of this.

In all liklihood one of the stances is broken at normal. Perhaps its the defensive AI or something that is lacking. We should try to narrow this down, try a game or two with all economic AI or mix and match and see if this is across the board or particular.
Reply #10 from Sins Forums Top

Currently the AI doesn't cheat. I'm 90% sure of this.

In all liklihood one of the stances is broken at normal. Perhaps its the defensive AI or something that is lacking. We should try to narrow this down, try a game or two with all economic AI or mix and match and see if this is across the board or particular.
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That is my plan to try and figure out the broken stance, I will do a fixed game with assigned stances and see which race this happens to. Of the top of my head I can say I have seen TEC and Advent do this, haven't see Vasari do it yet. Can't be sure of the stances they were in.


This AI doesn't cheat.
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I didn't think it did, because if this is how it "cheats" then the AI is missing a lot of I.
Reply #11 from Sins Forums Top
EDIT.

P.S. > Well, on the "The AI is cheating!!" thread, Craig Fraser of Ironclad, has stated that the A.I. does not cheat. I am very surprised, and sorry to add : skeptical.

Reference : The AI is cheating!!