I don't much care for anything at all to do with politics.....it's my opinion that the founding fathers of this country would be shuddering in their mocassins and buckle boots if they were to see what today's politicians have done to once respected offices.

Politicians have become crooked and untrustworthy....all of 'em

I'm gonna go out back and get bug bit and take pictures of nature now....

while it's still here >

I watch it not really as a political movie, its more a comedy for me.
And I agree with _footsie_ at the same time
Time for my walk.

Citizen ToeJo said:

Please...no disrespect intended, but you can't say whether he is or is not an American because you are not an American. You have no reference point. ... Please, come to America and truly be an American before you make a judgment about whether someone is "American" or not.

Well my friend, I work with American people who run American companies
on a daily basis making games and applications, I have done that for
many years and I have visited my American friends on several occasions.

I'm finding it quite interesting to see that a few people want to brand
other people who feel that the current government are doing really bad things,
as "un-American", sort of like an "outcast", someone who should be
driven away(?).

Was it "un-American" to get rid of Nixon? Was it "un-American"
to impeach Clinton?

I mean, who has the soul right to dictate what you must say and think
to get the label "100% Real American"?

For example, I am very sceptical of how our current Swedish government
are running the country though I'm not branded "un-Swedish".

People in America are like people in the rest of the world, they
are mostly quite nice and since they are many they usually have
many different ideas and views on things.

Some are like some swedes and believe everything the government
and the media tell them to believe. Others again feel that
it is important to search for the "stories behind the stories".



[Message Edited]

something with that story that doesn't feel right.

yeah. half of it was fabricated, twisted, and blown out of proportion.

Michael Moore is your classic yellow journalist. he contradicts himself by using the same tactics in his articles that he attacks the press for using, and he takes a small peice of fact and exploads it into fiction. regardless of 'eye witness interviews' and 'first hand accounts' from the people he interviews for this film, i have no reason to believe he wouldn't twist such reports around the way he does with everything else, for example by only showing certain interviews that send a spacific message, and only relaying messages that support his own opinions in politics, and which make ever so dramatic the 'action' of that horrible day for the simple purpose of making something entertaining, and spurring people to make protest.

there is a way to tell history, and to memorialize people. he is not the man who should be doing it. additionally, i agree with so many others of you: i don't want to put any money into that mans pocket.

http://www.michaelmoore.com/words/index.php?messageDate=2004-02-11

Worthy read. A letter to Bush from M. Moore, regarding the press conference here:
http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2004/02/20040210-3.html [a very funny video, what a dodgy guy!]

Interesting read, as well, explains a little more of the movie:
http://www.michaelmoore.com/words/index.php?messageDate=2004-06-18

More reading:
http://www.michaelmoore.com/words/index.php?messageDate=2004-06-18

Funny, many people shared the same disdain for Mark Lane when he wrote "Rush to Judgement' in 1966. [which was a piece by piece tear-down of the Warren Commission's report on the assassination] ..

..besides, if exploring all possibilities when seeking truth makes one un-American, c'est la vie!

More links
http://www.michaelmoore.com/words/wackoattacko/

Nope,

As a few others have mentioned, I'd be interested in the subject matter if it were presented by anyone else, but Moore no longer has any real credibility. He couldn't investigate the location of his own head if you gave him a search party and a copy of Gray's Anatomy.

Neither this, nor 'Bowling' qualify as an honest documentary. It's really nothing more than a blog screed, writ large.

I would, however, be interested in an *honest* evaluation of the subject matter.

[Message Edited]

http://www.michaelmoore.com/words/index.php?messageDate=2004-06-18

what an ass. i always try to keep an open mind when i read his rants, but all i got out of this was whining and name calling.

read his pps's.

I will see it. It's bad enough that if a news source wants to do a story about the Bush administration they are threatened to have their liscence pulled by the FCC and fined millions of dollars. If you haven't heard about all thats been going on with the Bush Administration then I suggest you get off your 'puter for a couple hours a day and find reputible news sources that WILL speak of the CRIMES commited and form your own oppinions.

Don't give me this UN_American crap either ... born and raised in the best place on earth to live has given me the right to want to know! Good or bad, I WANT TO KNOW! If you're so narrow minded that you will let you government do as they please when and how they want then YOU I say are the un_American. For the people, by the people ... not, for the chosen few by the wallet. Knowledge is power. Empower yourselves!

Nope. Never.

From the above link:
"They also don't like pets and are mean to small children. Too many of them are named "Fred.""

Hmm. I'm conservative, have cats, niece, nephew, 3 great nieces and am most definitely not named Fred.

I wouldn't waste the money of my worst enemy on this shlockumentary.

I figured he was a one hit wonder. I get the feeling that putting his films up as advante garde, indy, trash is some how lending street cred to his form of Bushwhacking journalism. No PUN intended.

I can see what kind of people are here...betcha both Conservs and Liberals... Moore's films are undoubtedly polarized and by the view point of Republicans undoubtedly "un-American". Even by some Demos he does seem to hate the country (in particular Bush and his men) a lot. This is said in no doubt as you can see what he said in last year's oscars about Bush. I myself live in America, but I'm not an American, there's no such thing as being "un-American" and if you are one of those who has so deeply patriotic feelings toward your country, then i feel bad for you. To me such blind patriotism is no more than blatant stupidity and ignorance to waht is realy going on out there. News stations are inevitably biased and always seems to show you the "bad news" and the truth cannot really be conveyed through them. The only way for one to see what's going is if they were there first hand. And since not many of you have been out there, there's no way you can comment on everything based on your beliefs.

I've always view Michael Moore as the Richard Hoagland of documentaries

one thing positive about the movie even for those who say at this time they will not ever watch it.

it has people talking...

I have read a few articles about this movie yesterday, and it's all very good.
One journalist was saying that he couldn't believe that this documentary really had the artistic qualities that earned it the Palme d'Or at Cannes. But he said that he was actually surprised when he saw the movie. Moore apparently masters very effective cinematic techniques in this fast paced movie that really does a good job trying to convince you about "the truth". The jouralist said that he has no idea if all of this was true or not, in this day and age where the NY Times has to appologise for publishing false information, it's so difficult to find out what the truth really is. However, this movie sure raises doubt in your mind. Moores' open intentions are to stop Bush from being elected at the next presidential elections. Will he raise enough doubts in the Americans minds to influence people's votes I guess we will have to wait and see.

I'm leaving in about a half hour to go see it. I'm such an idiot. Sometimes I can't stand myself.

I'd hate myself if I *didn't* see it or want to see it. I can't imagine hating a man so much as to pass up the opportunity to look at things from a different perspective or perhaps one I didn't ponder [let's face it, no one can cover EVERY angle on their own].
I suppose it's like the "Hey everyone!.. Let's ALL hate Celine Dion because she's successful, has a beautiful voice and if someone denies that we can always fall back on the same old tear-down 'she doesn't write her own material!'"

I don't care one way or the other about Moore. The reason I won't see his work is that he has zero credibility from a documentary standpoint. His work is nothing but an opinion screed, which is fine, but it offers nothing substantial to the debate. Moore really is nothing more than the political equivalent of the moon hoax proponents, and so on. Rather than arguing the merits of the evidence and then coming to a conclusion, he starts with the conclusion he wants to reach and picks and chooses the evidence to support his position, without regard to that which does not. (to be fair, he isn't the only one who does that).

I'm completely interested in seeing and hearing the evidence and arguments for both sides of this issue (and have already started that process). It's just that Moore cannot be trusted to present an honest appraisal of the issue, nor can some of his reactionary adversaries.

It wouldn't be so bad if so many people didn't believe everything they hear.

still, another opinion from a friend of mine:


Greetings,

I just got back from Fahrenheit 9/11. And man, am I drained. Never have I seen a film that has dragged me through so many emotions in a 2 hour period. I think ALL the left and the right wing views were right. It's funny, it's scary, it's manipulative, patriotic, un-patrotic, I laughed...I cried...so on and so forth... I strongly encourage all of you to go see this film, regardless of your political views because even if Moore is right about 1% of what he says, then we are in a much scarier time and place then I could have ever thought (or at least try to digest all at once).

So if you see 1 movie this summer, see Fahrenheit 9/11 because:

1. Spiderman is gonna win
2. Predator will defeat the Alien
3. Will Smith will kill all the robots

But "9/11" will help you make a decision (either way) about your future.

Anyway, enough ranting, Later.

Adam Baker

PS Dodgeball was AWESOME, and I don't like Ben Stiller