ElWhopO ElWhopO

Be smarter than everyone else-have the facts on your side!

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Be smarter than everyone else-have the facts on your side!

Let's cut through the ***** and be smarter

http://www.wikipedia.org/
from GalCiv2 Forums
Seriously, people, we all have a tendency to repeat lies and misleading information. I catch myself doing it all the time. I see people saying things in posts in these forums that are almost as misled and ignorant as some of the ones I blurt out.

IMHO (in my humble opinion) a large majority of the conflicts in the forum posts, especially political and social, are generated by a lack of factual information and, frankly, the fact that we Humans are subject to different forms of propaganda and crowd control blurbs in all forms of the media, in all corners of the world.

Whether we like it or not, that is a fact that all Humans should be able to recognize and overcome, but it's especially hard when the facts are twisted and misrepresented, and once again that leads to many unnecessary misunderstandings and conflicts which will eventually lead nowhere except to the slave barracks.

Nevertheless, there is still hope for the Human race, and what many intelligent people consider to be the BEST SOURCE FOR FACTUAL INFORMATIION ON ANY SUBJECT is Wikipedia, The Free Encyclopedia. It can be read in many different languages. It's available to you on the internet right now, just a tiny little click away, and having the facts at your disposal just might be the smartest thing you've ever done. I think it has been for me, ignorant as I am.

http://www.wikipedia.org/
Good Luck and Good Hunting to you all, see you on the other side.
off-topic
90,692 views 97 replies
Reply #76 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
P.S. - Do you play GCII regularly? There are quite a few parallels to political domination in the game. I was just asking cause i noticed you haven't posted any games on the Metaverse, not that it's any of my business (unless of course my sexual orientation is your business?) ...


  some days i'm late to work 'cause i was playing GC2 before i left. i do most of my posting at work (most, at least). i've never played MV for several reasons. i don't care about medals or even how much my score compares to those of others. even if i did i'm lazy, and i imagine i'd probably only ever upload one or two games if i bothered anwyay, and they'd probably suck, just done for the sake of having scores. i play with mods on almost all the time - i like to experiment. i've also never had a driver's license for lots of reasons, and none of the reasons for either of these things have anything to do with either my business or your sexual orientation, both of which have nothing to do with each other. my ribs hurt.

Exactly which laws need to be changed? There are already laws against discrimination of all types ... are gays the next "Nazi Party" ?


are you joking? the firt part i mean, not the nazi thing. if you're serious about that, i wouldn't even know where to start.
Reply #77 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
"triv·i·al·ize (trĭv'ē-ə-līz') Pronunciation Key
tr.v. triv·i·al·ized, triv·i·al·iz·ing, triv·i·al·iz·es
To make or cause to appear trivial: tried to trivialize their criticisms."
[http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/trivialize]
Elemental: Reforged
Reply #78 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
trivial
1432, "of the trivium," from M.L. trivialis, from trivium "first three of the seven liberal arts," from L., lit. "place where three roads meet," from tri- "three" + via "road." The basic notion is of "that which may be found anywhere, commonplace, vulgar." The meaning "ordinary" (1589) and "insignificant" (1593) were in L. trivialis "commonplace, vulgar," originally "of or belonging to the crossroads." The verb trivialize is attested from 1846.
http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=trivial

i was curious.
Reply #79 from GalCiv2 Forums Top

hmm... off the bat, i never meant to suggest that you shouldn't speak your mind. i'm not sure what i did to give that impression; maybe the word 'digression.' all i meant to say with that was that our discussions had gone off the original topics; i don't consider that a bad thing at all.


sorry the word disgression makes it to me sounds like its something that should not be said. I am sorry I took it diffrently than you.


i think i responded to part of what you said above in the other forum, the part about consideration for the future. i am thinking about the future; i'm thinking about future generations of queer people and the struggles they may or may not have to endure.


I can relate to that.


i'm not really sure i'm even proposing to change culture directly. a culture that accepts and supports gay families already exists in some parts of the country. it's the laws i'm proposing to change. since adoption seems to be the big hang-up, i'd suggest thinking about it from the child's point of view: the foster child who wakes up with nightmares of being taken away from the two fathers who are the only loving family he's have ever had. i bet he wishes they could adopt him. god forbid we should ever actually determine policy based on the desires and opinions of people actually involved.


I did try to say that I think gay foster parents should be allowed to adopt the kids that they do take care of, I see no sense in


okay, you're worried about culture changing too quickly, but culture's already changing pretty quickly. the very fact that you can openly claim being pagan (let alone know how to use the word in a non-derogatory way) is only because culture in the U.S. has already changed very quickly over the last 60 years. if you'd have "come out" of the pagan closet in the 40s, you'd have been paganism's Matthew Shepard. i'm not trying to say that gays have it worse; i know that tens of thousands of European pagans were burned alive in the past (and gays were secondary targets in the holocaust).


I d say its been longer for both. The Hell Fire Club has been an open secret since Lord Byron's day. If a group of self professed Satanist can survive in a christian nation so can we. At least one of the Founding fathers was apart of this club, Ben Franklin. I would also bet that there was homosexuality (and/or bisexuality) practiced amongs the Hell Fires. You can look em up if you like they are still around today.

Also I am not completely open about my "paganism". While I do wear the celtic warrior mustache most people (even the neo-druids) don t get it. I found that when I used to be more open about it I was really looking to just start fights ( of whatever nature). I normally hear people call me an agnostic or atheist!

If we don t preserve this culture why can t the burning times come again?
Reply #81 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
If we don t preserve this culture why can t the burning times come again?


they can. they can also come again if we DO preserve this culture. pagans and christians were living in europe side-by-side for quite some time for the burning times; jews and christians and pagans long before the Inquisition; christians and muslims and jews before the crusades.

have you ever heard of "culture of fear" theories. wikipedia's article on the subject leaves some things to be desired. suffice it to say, a lot of social theorists have become increasingly interested with the role fear plays on a societal level. can the emotion be engineered and used to manipulate human actions? i don't really want to go into the theories too deeply. some are rather tenuous arguments, others lack objective evidence. the best description i've heard regarding fear in the modern world and its relationship to action is in the work of Anthony Giddens. but i think if you want to talk about fear in civic culture, turn to one of the original experts.

"We got around to the subject of war again and I said that, contrary to his attitude, I did not think that the common people are very thankful for leaders who bring them war and destruction.

"Why, of course, the people don't want war," Goering shrugged. "Why would some poor slob on a farm want to risk his life in a war when the best that he can get out of it is to come back to his farm in one piece. Naturally, the common people don't want war; neither in Russia nor in England nor in America, nor for that matter in Germany. That is understood. But, after all, it is the leaders of the country who determine the policy and it is always a simple matter to drag the people along, whether it is a democracy or a fascist dictatorship or a Parliament or a Communist dictatorship."

"There is one difference," I pointed out. "In a democracy the people have some say in the matter through their elected representatives, and in the United States only Congress can declare wars."

"Oh, that is all well and good, but, voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same way in any country."


-- A conversation between Hermann Goering and Gustave Gilbert, a German-speaking intelligence officer and psychologist who was granted free access by the Allies to all the prisoners held in the Nuremberg jail. ref.: WWW Link
Reply #82 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
Wikipedia is where you should get your amusement, not your facts.

Oh I dunno, I get a lot of amusement here, too.

At least in this thread there is a lot less tendency to throw false statements around disguised as facts, with emotional/popularity import attached as a cover story. Ya never know when someone will quote from Wikipedia or dictionary.com or some other source and make someone with a secret polital/personal agenda look like the "Trojan Horse" they really are.

... and that's a good thing for everyone. In fact, that's the reason I felt the urge to start this thread in the first place. Everyone has their own version of history, and have an unfortunate tendency to, well, twist the truth a little. Me included.

However in self-defense I'd like to say my "secret" agenda is to intellectually empower anyone that is a victim of this exploitation and abuse, me included, by reminding everyone facts are available just a few seconds away. Online.

If someone can read this, then they can also read real actual history, not some amateur Hitler's version of history. They can read encyclopedic facts, not go around repeating rumors the world is flat. They can get the dictionary definitions for words that are used incorrectly and have caused confusion.

As far as amusement ... well everyone wishes they were a comedian, but only a few actually make it to the top. Gene Wilder/Steve Martin are my favorites!

Wikipedia.org - http://en.wikipedia.org
Dictionary.com - http://dictionary.reference.com/
History.com - http://www.history.com/
Discovery.com - http://www.discovery.com/
science - http://www.sciencemag.org/
Voice of America News - http://www.voanews.com/english/portal.cfm
Reply #83 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
hmm... off the bat, i never meant to suggest that you shouldn't speak your mind. i'm not sure what i did to give that impression; maybe the word 'digression.' all i meant to say with that was that our discussions had gone off the original topics; i don't consider that a bad thing at all.
As long as it goes your way? (friendly poke in the RIBS)   


i'm not really sure i'm even proposing to change culture directly. a culture that accepts and supports gay families already exists in some parts of the country. it's the laws i'm proposing to change
"The persecution and genocide were accomplished in stages. Legislation to remove the Jews from civil society was enacted years before the outbreak of World War II. Concentration camps were established in which inmates were used as slave labour until they died of exhaustion or disease." [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holocaust]

Exactly which laws need to be changed? There are already laws against discrimination of all types ... are gays the next "Nazi Party" ?


i know that tens of thousands of European pagans were burned alive in the past (and gays were secondary targets in the holocaust).
"Other groups were persecuted and killed by the regime, including the Roma, Soviet POWs, disabled people, homosexual men, Jehovah's Witnesses, Catholic Poles, and political prisoners.[3][4] Many scholars do not include these groups in the definition of the Holocaust, defining it as the genocide of the Jews" [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holocaust]

Nice to be able to write history to suit yourself, eh? What an example of bigotry. Maybe this needs to be changed first?
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"Taking into account all the victims of Nazi persecution, the death toll rises considerably: estimates generally place the total number of victims at nine to 11 million.[6]" [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holocaust]

... and that doesn't even mention the 13 million Joseph Stalin murdered (may he burn in Hell forever). All total, I've heard it said that WWII resulted in the deaths of over 60 million! Of that revised WWII ONLY total, 10% or less were Jews, even less Roma (gypsies), even less religion-related, even less homosexuals, and even less political.
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Of the political murders, the first ones to go were the homosexuals that helped Hitler form the Nazi Party in the first place (approx. June 29, 1934) six or seven years before the war started "officially." I've heard it said Hitler had them killed partly to prevent them from blabbing that he was a homosexual or sexual-weird as well ...

"The Night of the Long Knives (German: Nacht der langen Messer) or "Operation Hummingbird," was a purge of Adolf Hitler's potential political rivals in the Sturmabteilung (SA).

The SA (sometimes known as the "Stormtroopers" or "Brownshirts") , a paramilitary organization of the Nazi Party, played a key role in the Nazi rise to power in the 1920s and early 1930s.[1] Once Hitler had transformed Germany into a one-party state, however," [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Night_of_the_long_knives]

"dislike that many conservative officers expressed over Röhm's homosexuality and some other SA leaders. Industrialists such as Albert Voegler, Gustav Krupp, Alfried Krupp, Fritz Thyssen and Emile Kirdorf, who had provided the funds for the Nazi victory, were unhappy with Röhm's socialism and his claims that the real revolution had still to take place." [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Night_of_the_long_knives]
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"Hitler presented himself publicly as a man without an intimate domestic life, dedicated to his political "mission". He had a fiancée, Mimi Reiter in the 1920s, and later had a mistress, Eva Braun. He had a close bond with his niece Geli Raubal, which many commentators have claimed was sexual, although there is no evidence that proves this.[75] All three women attempted suicide during their relationship with him, a fact which has led to speculation that Hitler may have had unusual sexual fetishes, such as urolagnia, as was claimed by Otto Strasser. Reiter, the only one to survive the Nazi regime, denies this.[76] During the war and afterwards psychoanalysts offered numerous inconsistent psycho-sexual explanations of his pathology.[77] More recently Lothar Machtan has argued in his book The Hidden Hitler that Hitler was homosexual, while others argue that he was largely asexual." [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hitler#Sexuality]

P.S. - Do you play GCII regularly? There are quite a few parallels to political domination in the game. I was just asking cause i noticed you haven't posted any games on the Metaverse, not that it's any of my business (unless of course my sexual orientation is your business?) ...   


So, is it true Hitler was homosexual? and if so, how does this affect people's perceptions of homosexual's today?

Is it true that the SA (sometimes known as the "Stormtroopers" or "Brownshirts") were led by a homosexual, and went around glorifying all the stealing, murdering, persecuting, and abuse they did as some kind of "Holy Crusade"? How does that affect people's perceptions of homosexual's today?

Is it true that very recently some national gay liberation party actually sued the Boy Scouts of America (BSA) - because BSA wanted to protect young boys from being pushed into sexual confrontations with sexual predators?
Reply #84 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
So, is it true Hitler was homosexual? and if so, how does this affect people's perceptions of homosexual's today?

Is it true that the SA (sometimes known as the "Stormtroopers" or "Brownshirts") were led by a homosexual, and went around glorifying all the stealing, murdering, persecuting, and abuse they did as some kind of "Holy Crusade"? How does that affect people's perceptions of homosexual's today?


couldn't tell you if it's true or not. i think people tend to see Nazism in relation to a few of its intellectual engineers; they fail to keep in mind the conditions in Germany that made such an abhorent ideology seem like a good thing to the masses.

it might be true that some of the inner ring of Nazis were homosexual. whether that possibility affects perceptions of gays in general is another question. my sense is that people who've never gotten to know gays and instead wallow in their own stereotypical superstitions might be likely to believe anything.

Is it true that very recently some national gay liberation party actually sued the Boy Scouts of America (BSA) - because BSA wanted to protect young boys from being pushed into sexual confrontations with sexual predators?


not sure; if it was, i didn't follow it.
Reply #85 from GalCiv2 Forums Top

they can. they can also come again if we DO preserve this culture. pagans and christians were living in europe side-by-side for quite some time for the burning times; jews and christians and pagans long before the Inquisition; christians and muslims and jews before the crusades.


yeah but I also know that the Jihad's was before the Crusades. Also that right now the christians are more willing to say its a crime to kill other peoples without due cause ( I got nothing against someone killing me in self-defense). You might get that from which muslim country? Turkey is the only muslim country that I THINK would give a fair shot at it. Others might to but its the only one that comes to my mind.

So for me its really situational... now I would prefer the cristians but ohh say during the reconquesta I would have sided with the Moors vs the Spainish... so I do see what your saying but I think your looking for a PERFECT solution and I don t see one ever coming. Everything has consequences both good and bad.


have you ever heard of "culture of fear" theories. wikipedia's article on the subject leaves some things to be desired. suffice it to say, a lot of social theorists have become increasingly interested with the role fear plays on a societal level. can the emotion be engineered and used to manipulate human actions? i don't really want to go into the theories too deeply. some are rather tenuous arguments, others lack objective evidence. the best description i've heard regarding fear in the modern world and its relationship to action is in the work of Anthony Giddens. but i think if you want to talk about fear in civic culture, turn to one of the original experts.


Yeah I have but I think that its is mostly bunk. Some fear is good after all. "culture of fear" theories tend to sound like its all bad. To me you might as well say we should not have fought WWII with those ideas.



<"We got around to the subject of war again and I said that, contrary to his attitude, I did not think that the common people are very thankful for leaders who bring them war and destruction.


But it wasnt that long ago that the common man did take home the spoils of war. It is only modern times were looting is no longer allowed that they dont. So I think its mostly trying to play nice that screws it up.

Also some of the policies that take place give the common man more without him knowing it. Like the U.S. Revolutionary war wasn t really fought over "no taxation without repesentation", it was just a line. That war was fought over the ablity to manufacture goods here. The common man would not have wanted it for that reason but he did see the benefits of it.

Reply #86 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
So, is it true Hitler was homosexual? and if so, how does this affect people's perceptions of homosexual's today?


Not as far as I know.

He was a vegetarian, though... so, just to be safe, we really should throw all the vegetarians in prison or something.

Just kidding, but I have actually heard people use Hitler as an argument against vegetarianism; it has to be the funniest debating tactic ever, I think, and I am a vegetarian (well, pescetarian).
Reply #87 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
But it wasnt that long ago that the common man did take home the spoils of war. It is only modern times were looting is no longer allowed that they dont. So I think its mostly trying to play nice that screws it up.


and i suppose all the raping women and enslaving children was a good thing too, right?
Reply #88 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
and instead wallow in their own stereotypical superstitions might be likely to believe anything.
Is it true that very recently some national gay liberation party actually sued the Boy Scouts of America (BSA) - because BSA wanted to protect young boys from being pushed into sexual confrontations with sexual predators?
not sure; if it was, i didn't follow it.
Yes, I heard about it while on campus at a major university. When I expressed concern about this tactic in a couple of my classes, and to a couple of gay people at a booth they set up on the commons to recruit support ..... I commented that it seemed rather intrusive and ... well, Stormtrooper-ish ... i immediately became intensely unpopular.

So much so that gays were following me around and harassing me, and purposely sitting behind me in class and kicking my chair! Some gays are the most ****ed-up people I've ever met, worse than anything else I've ever seen. They are the most bigoted and discriminatory group of misinformed and ignorant sycophants I've ever had the misfortune to meet. Is it any wonder I refuse to believe letting gays adopt children is a good idea? It's more like the old oriental practice of selling kids to brothels at age 9 ! You suggest "getting to know them" is a solution? Bah Hah Hah Hah! Might as well just lie down and let the tanks run over you, it's the same thing IMHO.

Oh, btw, how do you know I'm not a homosexual who is really a good Human being and therefore disapproves strongly of "The Gay [political-stormtroopers-cough] Movement"?
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"From Wikipedia's newest articles:

...that the Queensland Court of Disputed Returns once heard an election dispute from a person who claimed that the Queensland Government was unconstitutional but who still wished to be elected to it?

On this Day...

1862 – In a rowing boat travelling on the River Thames from Oxford to Godstow, Lewis Carroll told Alice Liddell and her sisters a story that would eventually form the basis for his children's book Alice's Adventures in Wonderland ...

1941 – German AB Action operation in Poland: After capturing Lwów, the Nazis executed approximately 45 professors of the University of Lwów. "

[ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Main_Page ]
-----------------

I just love Wikipedia, don't you?   
Reply #89 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
Not as far as I know.
ghostwes - It is disputed, and it says so right on Wikipedia it isn't conclusive (and so I quoted it accurately, above). There IS the question of how his niece died, and the timing about when he(Hitler) was garnering support from the industrialists (who btw didn't like homosexuals) ... whether it was suicide or a hush-murder, and why the other two women we know about also tried suicide, is the interesting question. It's pretty easy to assume the wrong idea, but I think it's pretty clear that symptoms of sociopathic serial killing were there to be seen if anyone dared to look.

Reply #90 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
Yes, I heard about it while on campus at a major university. When I expressed concern about this tactic in a couple of my classes, and to a couple of gay people at a booth they set up on the commons to recruit support ..... I commented that it seemed rather intrusive and ... well, Stormtrooper-ish ... i immediately became intensely unpopular.

So much so that gays were following me around and harassing me, and purposely sitting behind me in class and kicking my chair! Some gays are the most ****ed-up people I've ever met, worse than anything else I've ever seen. They are the most bigoted and discriminatory group of misinformed and ignorant sycophants I've ever had the misfortune to meet. Is it any wonder I refuse to believe letting gays adopt children is a good idea? It's more like the old oriental practice of selling kids to brothels at age 9 ! You suggest "getting to know them" is a solution? Bah Hah Hah Hah! Might as well just lie down and let the tanks run over you, it's the same thing IMHO.


i'm not even sure i understand your story (why exactly where they pissed at you? - what did you say was stormtrooper-ish?). also, where the hell was this university? i mean, it sounds sorta like a berkeley-esque type place where being politically correct is the cool thing - in which case you're not talking only about gay political activists or gay people in general, but you're also talking about pretentious youth. pretentious youths tend to be asses in general, not matter what walk of life they come from. but perhaps that wasn't the case.

Oh, btw, how do you know I'm not a homosexual who is really a good Human being and therefore disapproves strongly of "The Gay [political-stormtroopers-cough] Movement"?


i really don't know a damn thing about you.
Reply #91 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
Some gays are the most ****ed-up people I've ever met, worse than anything else I've ever seen. They are the most bigoted and discriminatory group of misinformed and ignorant sycophants I've ever had the misfortune to meet.


Note that you said some gays here.

Is it any wonder I refuse to believe letting gays adopt children is a good idea?


Here you don't want any gays to be able to do that.

If you've had bad experiences with some of a particular group--gays or what have you--there's really no reason why you should condemn them all, surely?
Reply #92 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
If you've had bad experiences with some of a particular group--gays or what have you--there's really no reason why you should condemn them all, surely?


I would tend to agree.

There is a 90/10 thoery in Law Enforcement. Essentally 90% of the crime is caused by 10% of the population. The factual accuracy of this statement is doubtful, but that is not the point. The point is that the majority of bad experiences are caused by relatively few people. It's important not to generalize and stereotype these negative exeperiences on entire populations.
Reply #93 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
Maybe my point about being followed around and harassed by a bunch of smack-tards had more to do with people changing the subjects of someone else's thread so they could have a forum for their own favorite subject; which probably wouldn't have an audience if posted up-front?

Why don't you guys go start another thread of your own to talk about whatever it is you're selling? This thread is about facts and the Wikipedia, thanks very much, have a nice day.

"On this day...
July 6: Independence Day in Malawi (1964) and in Comoros (1975), and Statehood Day in Lithuania (1253); Jan Hus Day in the Czech Republic; the festival of San Fermín begins in Pamplona, Spain; 100th Anniversary of the birth of painter Frida Kahlo (b. 1907).

1415 – Jan Hus (pictured), founder of the Christian reform movement Hussite, was burned at the stake for committing heresy.

1887 – King Kalākaua of Hawai'i was forced to sign the Bayonet Constitution, stripping the Hawaiian monarchy of much of its authority as well as disfranchising all Asians, most native Hawaiians, and the poor.

1885 – French chemist Louis Pasteur successfully tested his vaccine against rabies on nine-year-old Joseph Meister after he was bitten by an infected dog.

1942 – Anne Frank and her family went into hiding in the "Secret Annexe" above her father's office in an Amsterdam warehouse. "
[ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Main_Page ]

P.S. - This is the second time I've mentioned this. Either show some respect for other people or I'll have to ask the mods to intervene.
Reply #94 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
I must say, this thread has taken a turn for the strange. I don't really understand why...

Maybe my point about being followed around and harassed by a bunch of smack-tards had more to do with people changing the subjects of someone else's thread so they could have a forum for their own favorite subject; which probably wouldn't have an audience if posted up-front?


Well, was that your point? Did the event you described not actually happen, then? I must confess that I'm a bit confused by this response.

There is nothing particularly sacrosanct about the topic of a forum's thread, and it was off-topic to begin with, so who cares. Regardless, I don't think anyone here is trying to change the subject; it's just the nature of forum discussions: these changes happen organically, and really aren't anything to get upset about.

Nor does it seem like anyone here is harassing you. I certainly don't think that I am, unless questioning your logic above constitutes harassment. Given the original nature of this post, though, and things you have said elsewhere in this thread about hating bigotry etc, I figured you would be open to discussing these things, in the interest of clarification, combating of ignorance, and having facts on one's side, etc.

As for "favourite subjects", I stand guilty as charged -- I consider defending the civil rights of my fellow human beings to be a very worthy cause, and something that I will go out of my way to do. Despite being straight myself, I don't like to hear people saying that gays should not have the same rights as heterosexuals w.r.t. adoption and marriage etc. It's discrimination, and it's about time it changed.

Why don't you guys go start another thread of your own to talk about whatever it is you're selling? This thread is about facts and the Wikipedia, thanks very much, have a nice day.


Not selling anything, my friend. If you don't want the thread to be about gay rights, you probably shouldn't say things like "So, is it true Hitler was homosexual? and if so, how does this affect people's perceptions of homosexual's today?" or "are gays the next "Nazi Party"?". If you were saying the same things about blacks or Jews or whatever, you would be getting the same responses, I suspect. This goes beyond whatever the thread was initially about.

P.S. - This is the second time I've mentioned this. Either show some respect for other people or I'll have to ask the mods to intervene.


I don't think anyone here has been disrespectful, and I'm honestly not sure where you're getting that from. If you mean my asking you for clarification in the post above, fair enough, but I really don't see why the mods would have any interest in intervening in that case. If you feel it's warranted, though, then by all means go ahead and do so.
Reply #95 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
Compassion, honesty, strength, courage, intellect, and responsibility! Apply these standards to everything you do, and you will be a beacon of light even in the darkest hour.


Maybe my point about being followed around and harassed by a bunch of smack-tards had more to do with people changing the subjects of someone else's thread so they could have a forum for their own favorite subject; which probably wouldn't have an audience if posted up-front?
Why don't you guys go start another thread of your own to talk about whatever it is you're selling? This thread is about facts and the Wikipedia, thanks very much, have a nice day.


so i guess that doesn't include the honesty of simply saying you want to keep "your" forum on topic? i guess that responsibility doesn't include misrepresenting the purpose of an anecdote? i guess that strength isn't strong enough to let go of your own creation.

so, i'll go back to the subject for you. if you want to impress other nitwits with a plethora of questionable facts lacking any theoretical unity or systematic coherence, turn to wikipedia. if you want to "be smarter than everyone else," get a real education.

PS: that's not aimed at anyone in particular. all i'm saying is that facts are meaningless without the mental discipline it takes to make sense of and order them, and that usually comes from education more than anywhere else.
Reply #96 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
"Nevertheless, there is still hope for the Human race, and what many intelligent people consider to be the BEST SOURCE FOR FACTUAL INFORMATIION ON ANY SUBJECT is Wikipedia, The Free Encyclopedia. It can be read in many different languages. It's available to you on the internet right now, just a tiny little click away, and having the facts at your disposal just might be the smartest thing you've ever done. I think it has been for me, ignorant as I am."

This is a joke, right?

Anybody can - and everybody does - contribute to the wikipedia. In addition there are no checks whatsoever on the factual accuracy of the articles.

Is it fine for occasional, casual reference? Sure.

Is it a replacement for in-depth research? No way.

Is there any guarantee that what you're reading is factual? NO. The wikipedia is in no way a replacement for original research.

In addition, wikipedia articles are often vandalized - which can be as obvious as a total defacement, or as mundane as replacing a couple of words to alter (sometimes drastically) the meaning of key phrases in an article. So you do have to be careful about that - often checking the history of the article and some independent sources is a good idea.

There is a 90/10 thoery in Law Enforcement. Essentally 90% of the crime is caused by 10% of the population. The factual accuracy of this statement is doubtful, but that is not the point. The point is that the majority of bad experiences are caused by relatively few people. It's important not to generalize and stereotype these negative exeperiences on entire populations.


Totally agree. If you're interested in logic, it's even considered a fallacy, often called "guilt by association" (the idea that something is wrong based upon its association with something (or someone) undesirable) or the "genetic fallacy" (the idea that something is wrong based upon irrelevant history).

And oh, yeah: Being a fallacy simply means the logic is wrong, not necessarily that the conclusion is wrong. If something is fallacious, it's a good idea to look for other sources of information that may shed light on the conclusion.

Creating a stereotype of an entire group based on a small subset of a group (or a single person) is a mistake. A very big mistake.
Reply #97 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
On thread-jacking: Almost all's fair in Off-Topic, neh?

On homo-nazis: Adolf Hitler is increasingly fictional because he is becoming a mythical figure like Alexander the Great, Suleiman the Magnificent, or Genghis Khan. Ernst Röhm (early Nazi leader later backstabbed by Hitler) was almost certainly a lover of men, but the Wiki does need citations on his page.

For me, my own orientation aside, the really interesting part of this tangle is the "fact" that being queer is a very unusual, cross-cutting category in the business of identity politics.

The big categories most often argued over are so-called racial and ethnic groups, which I tend to think of as breeding lines. Queer identity is an intersection of social possibility (widespread questioning of old rules about sex in general) and, apparently, some basic biology that makes girls smell funny to some of us boys and vice versa.