Attn: All Online Players Let's Double Our Player Base!!!

Our problem is not that people don't play SOSE; the game sold over 500,000 copies supposedly.  Rather, our problem is that about 98% of the people who bought game have never even considered playing it in online multiplayer.  That's the group of people we should try to bring online.

I have no idea how to bring those folks online.  The tiny percentage of people who bought SOSE and who read the forums can be reached at the forums with threads like, "Does a Fear of Pro Players Keep You from PLaying Sins Online?", but we don't have any real way of reaching the huge mass that only plays single player and that doesn't bother to read the forums.

Stardock/Ironclad are best positioned to do this since they can put out patches and bonus packs, such as an online multiplayer tutorial.

Another issue is that many people play Sins over Hamachi, but most of them are probably pirates or had problems with Impulse or an ideological aversion to using Impule.

We should enjoy this game while we can because when SC2 hits, it could put decimate the online player counts even further.

Yes it would be nice if all those offline people would play online, but we can do absolutly nothing about it.  That is, unless you know one of these fools in real life.  I call them fools cause they are missing out on the best part of sins.  Buying sins for single player is like dating a super model for the good conversations.  But we can influence people have not yet bought the game to buy the game for the multiplayer.  Since we are recruiting people we already know in the real world, we can get them to come online and play.  So go recruit your family, friends, and co-workers.

This fool loves single player.

problem is people like me can't get it to work online or am such a noob at it I can't get it too work

Why can't you get it to work online?  I am not super computer literate but I am proficient enough.  If you want to PM me maybe I can give you a hand.

The problem is that there is no drop-in MP support and matches take hours.

Unfortunately, Sins has been a particularly NOT user-friendly online gamec from the start. Where warcraft and starcraft are basically idiot-proof for getting online games to work, in Sins you need to have a pretty advanced understanding of port forwarding to make it work.

This is slightly better now that they introduced alloy (too little too late), but most of those 500,000 people you mentioned already made up their minds. Add to this problem the frequent mini-dumps that used to occur, and the usual fear of playing online by noobs, and it makes perfect sense that this game never took off online.

Bottom line, it just was never very well designed from a user-friendlyness, or reliability standpoint. 

IMO, things only are going to go downhill from here now that they made the genius decision to release "micro-expansions," that serve only to SPLIT the community online each time they are released. Already when you go online, half of the very few players there are looking for a game in the other version from the one you are looking for (entrenchment, or original).. As the game gets older, and yes, SC2 comes closer, Sins will get even weaker.

Too bad. :/

Either way, numbers of people who buy the game was never the problem, the game itself was. 

I'm hoping that the online multiplayer community will choose to either play Entrenchment or normal Sins.  My money is on people's tiring of Entrenchment after the novelty wears off and returning to regular Sins.

I agree with your points to an extent, but I don't think its primarily the lack of user-freindliness or reliability that is scaring away players. Even with these two downsides, I believe with drop-in support the MP scene would take-off dramatically. Most of my friends don't bother with the online scene because it means dedicating yourself to a 4-8 hour match (unless your playing with close friends and can save the match for later). Drop-in support would allow players to jump in and out of games for quick half hour sessions.

Sins wouldn't even need true drop-in support. It could be achieved by sending the Host of the game a request-message that a player wishes to take the spot of an AI-player. If the host agrees, the entire session is paused while the new player downloades the saved-game. Saved-games aren't that large, and I am sure the other players will usually be willing to wait 30 seconds for a new player to join. The host could also be given an option to drop the player if the download is taking too long.

People fear the competiton of these types of games online.

I don't like playing online because it seems like no matter how much experience you have playing in SP, the multi-player scene will always be one step ahead.

Hi guys I am getting into the online matches during the spring break season, look forward to learn more about micros.  Any good thread about micro skills that I can read on this forum?

Watch starcraft proffesional players when the koreans broadcast their stuff

Pretty much this, my first online game consisted of me trying an 8 person FFA which I later found out to be two players on smurf accounts who fed each other. I was lucky enough to be the first target and even though I was 2nd overall in ecnonmy the guy that attacked me had 2x my army and already had carriers and hosks when I was barely able to get a few carriers of my own.

It just wasn't fun for the amount of time it took to get to that point. The time it takes for players to get a decent size army is like equal to 2-3 starcraft or warcraft games. I like sins because it's slow, but at the same time it's not fun to play online considering I have a good chance of facing a person who's owned the game much longer then me. (I've only had it since January of this year) The irony is sins is a good single player game yet it has no single player story.

FFA is the worst way to learn/play sins due to what you just mentioned.  I like ffa only if the teams are locked to prevent what just happened to you.

This is key. Sins feels... stretched, for lack of a better word. Most of the time you're doing stuff only at half capacity. Combine this with the typical RTS pitfall of unlikely comebacks, and it's easy to see why Sins isn't a very appealing MP game - no one likes a drawn out losing game, and most competitively minded players don't much like drawn out victories either.

Even so, I bought Entrenchment and maybe will give it a whirl someday. Hopefully player numbers have improved at Euro times.

Even for an FPS, you have to pay your nooby dues if you want to become good at it in online multiplayer.  Years ago, when I first started playing (the original) Unreal Tournament online, I could hardly move without getting whacked; now I'm a great player.  I had to do it for Sins as well.

Xinoxlx, I think you might have a better experience if you tried a team game with locked teams where the player skill between the teams was balanced.  (Maybe look for a game called "New Players Only" or some such.)  I agree with JohnJames that as a general rule, FFA isn't a great game to play online.  Also, even if the teams are locked, friends could team up together and you might still get two-wayed.

For those reasons I think team games are your best bet.  You might also look for team games where the teams are numerically imbalanced--say 3 good players v. 5 average and new players.

I agree, but once the game has been decided, people can always just quit or surrender.  That's what I do when I'm on the losing team.  I say "ggs" and then hit whichever option I think is most appropriate based on my performance.

Part of my own problem with playing online is:

1. I am terrible. This is far and away the biggest factor.

2. It seems like even a small game takes 2 hours (4 people on a small universe being a small game, I am sure 1v1 ends quite quickly).

Not that I think fun level is associated with the number of games you play in a night. However, a 2 hour (or longer) game means you have to devote that entire 2 hours to the game. I don't know about you folks, but its hard to get 2 hour span without at least one interruption (phone call, need to get another snack or drink, need to change the laundry to the dryer, someone in your family needs help with something, extremely urgent bathroom break, etc).

In faster, twitchier paced games like Team Fortress 2 or the like you can simply go to spectator for a round and it won't harm your team too much. Besides, you don't have that much invested in a 5 minute round anyways, so just walking away is easy. In an MMO such as World of Warcraft, one can communicate with your party members to take a break.

RTS games don't have that luxury. Even if you try to pause the game for a break, most players will simply unpause as soon as you leave to gain an advantage. Most RTS games like Warcraft 3 or Dawn of War make up for that by having relatively quick rounds (unless you play a massive 4v4 or something).

Even though Sins is slow-paced, a lot can happen in 5 minutes if you need to step away.

Also, I am TERRIBLE. I feel the game needs a few more tutorials in it. It is a very complex game and a few things need to be explained by the game itself (like how Shield Mitigation works, which I had explained to me by these very forums). Also, why are there gameplay options available but not mapped to a key (like Z-axis control, which I have still not tried out but I assume it means you can move in 3d if you want???)

Is there a good strategy primer out there? I browse the Strategy forum regularily but there isn't really a general guide from what I have seen.

One of the things i don't like (with all RTS that puts me off onlnie) is being ranked/stat recorded. With offline play you don't get ranked and can enjoy the game.

Saying that i also wouldn't wanna play a game for like 5 hours streight (If i had the time) only for someone to quit because you've destroyed their fleet/they get bored and can't be bothered to build it back up/recover.

That is just fear though.  Even the best fall in some funny ways in this game.  Today in one game I had my home planet destroyed before we evn got fleets out really.  Hard to explain but it wasn't my fault.  My units spread out to much and I didn't notice.  It just happens,  stop caring what others think and play.  You can always make another player name if you hate having loses or something.

Anyways,  besides me I have got 3 other people already to purchase the game and the expansion entranchment.  I think I did my part.  Two still need to log onto and try iron clad.  I didn't even have to do anything really,  they just walked in before we went out and saw me playing the game  and they started to the game has that effect.

I've converted one guy from Empire at War, and he'll soon be multiplayer-ing. I've converted another non-rts guy. Hopefully he''l multiplay too. Multiplayer FTW!

Go forth and Multiplay!

Some people might not have several hours a day to play online.  Work.