db0

Join Date 09/2008

So Civ5 is out...

...and it's just as buggy

I just got my copy and I'm surprised to see the number of horrible horrible bugs in it. The AI is not better than Elemental's (i.e. pretty much useless without heavy cheating). There are graphic/performance bugs as bad as Elemental's late-turn-slowdown. The balance is not the best either (Bushido just pwns all). Of course there's also the good stuff and I do enjoy the game, much like I enjoyed Elemental when it came out.

But like Elemental, the initial excitement will wear off and the bugs/balance will start to annoy so I will stop and wait for the patches. However, given the negativity in these forums, I was starting to get convinced that Elemental is not worth it. Civ5 came then and proved that the "perfect launch" just doesn't exist. If even an AAA and overhyped title like Civ5 can't get it right, I think that the launch of Elemental is at least tolerable. At least they were apologetic and understanding of their failures while I doubt that with Civ5 we'll get anything close to an apology. Certainly we're not going to get the same level of support that Stardock is known to provide.

So, as ironic as it may be, Civ5 changed my perspective on Elemental for the better.

How about you?

elemental

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Well, at least Civ5 is pretty:D The UI is nice. Once I saw pop-up in wrong order - something that is common in EWoM.

To say the true I haven't encountered any bug (apart of load bug) and haven't seen any slowdowns. And I'm not much about ballance and numbers. Just enjoying Chieftain lvl on small maps. And watching how the roads are being built.

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I'm pissed off. How could both Stardock and Firaxis fuck up a sure thing like this?

Civ V is pretty but devoid of depth. It leads you by the nose whether you want it to or not.

Elemental is pretty but devoid of depth. It dumps you in a world with no idea what to do.

In the long run, I think Elemental will be my favorite because Stardock is more likely than Firaxis to make that changes needed to make their game a classic.

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I would disagree with CIV 5 being devoid of depth its just different, combat, resource maangement, and culture add a ton of options in them.

And its a lot more stable then Elementals launch, never care what people say about AI becuase they all suck becuase no AI comes close to human intelligence or are unpredicatbility.

I have played 4 games of CIV 5 so far, each one different, played on an ice world, jungle world desert world and eartrh. Each Civ feels a little different and some times I go culture and peace some times, I make hitler look like jesus. I will liberate a city, then found a city a in the artic and then give that to the newly reformed nation, and take over there old capital hahaha.

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To say the true I haven't encountered any bug (apart of load bug) and haven't seen any slowdowns

by now I've had one game breaking one (where I actually had to look in the forums on how to work around it) and one disruptive one (requiring me to restart the game every few hours or so). The AI is bad enough that I steamroll everyone if I don't play at max difficulty and let the AI cheat as hell (and I'm not a good Civ player by far).

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Comparing CIV5 to Elemental is an insult against CIV. "...ain't the same ballpark, ain't the same league, ain't even the same fuckin' sport..."

'nuff said.

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Comparing CIV5 to Elemental is an insult against CIV.

Any arguments to go with that fanboism?

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I have come to this forum and I have read many who criticise Elemental and its release. I hear them wailing about "bugs" and "release" problems". They are like frightened, mewling children!

Yes, the day may come when strategy gaming finally dies, and the legacy of Master of Magic is nothing more than forgotten memory, lost amongst the stars. But it is not today. Today we still have brave warriors who are willing to fight and die for fantasy turn based games.

To the brave warriors in Stardock I say: QAPLA'! SURVIVE AND SUCCEED!

Gowron

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Y'all need to calm down, they are just video games. When did being a gamer turn into, lets look for all the cracks and issues in a game and debate it endlessly. If you don't like a game then STFU and stop playing it. I don't personally care if you love Elemental or Civilization over the other or if you hate them both equally, what is the point of so many threads? People sure love to bitch instead of live their lives, you'd think everyone was immortal with the time being spent bitching incessantly about a bunch of shit that doesn't even matter.

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@MrCapitalG: If there's one thing even more pathetic than bitching about games on the internet, it's whining about forum threads bitching about games on the internet

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Quoting db0,

reply 6

Any arguments to go with that fanboism?

What fanboism? What makes you think, that i find CIV5 to be flawless. Just because I'm not satisfied by Elemental and because I think that CIV5 is better I am a fanboi? If anything, it is you who seem to be one, judging from the way you are defending a beta quality pile of promises, that fail so badly when it comes to actually delivering the goods.

Oh sure, elemental has lots of promise.. lots of possibilities. The problem: none of those got realized. Its buggy, its unbalanced, its shallow, in my eyes, it is not a release quality product. As such, comparing it to anything is rather pointless.

There's your arguments. Hope you are happy.

Elemental *might* become a great game.. eventually.. some day in the future. Until that day comes however, i stand by my original opinion.

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What fanboism? What makes you think, that i find CIV5 to be flawless. Just because I'm not satisfied by Elemental and because I think that CIV5 is better I am a fanboi

The OP was never about claiming that one or the other is flawless or perfect, or even comparing them to each other. It was to point out that both games are buggy and unbalanced as hell. If you can't admit that, then you're either a fanboi or have an ax to grind aganist Elemental.

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I can't say I share the same opinion as the OP. I understand that some Civ 5 players are having compatibility problems but I don't think it's on the same scale as Elemental. Players who purchased Elemental not only had to deal with performance issues but also an incomplete gameplay experience. Civ 5 at least had clearly defined design goals which, as far as I can tell, have been reached.

Anyway, I'm seeing a thinly veiled attempt at equivalence in the OP's post. Maybe he's trying to justify his purchase...either way it's not helping Elemental to post stuff like this :/

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Quoting db0,

reply 11

Who do you think you are, that you can determine what I am? Do you know me? Are you some kind of supreme, omnipotent being? No and no. Then what do you expect to gain from offering such ridiculous choices, as "I either agree with you" or "I fall into the category of your chosing".

No I do not agree with you, I do believe that the OP was pointless to begin with, heavily biased by your own desire to justify yourself. I do believe that it is in fact insulting to compare the two games and quite frankly I couldnt care less what you think of me.

Oh and a nice way of contradicting yourself:

The OP was never about claiming that one or the other is flawless or perfect, or even comparing them to each other.

versus

The AI is not better than Elemental's (i.e. pretty much useless without heavy cheating). There are graphic/performance bugs as bad as Elemental's late-turn-slowdown.

Nah, clearly no comparison there. None at all.

As for the 'notion' of your OP, that is: let's forgive them because 'at least' they were honest about their failures. I wrote this once already today in a different thread: Honesty is an admirably quality, but it is neither a substitute or an excuse for the lack of competency. I could care less how honest they are about failing, as long as they are failing.

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Who gives a rats azz about CIV V here? This is a STARDOCK ELEMENTAL FORUM not some crappy CIV V forum for you to rave on about. Please lock this thread and send it to the abyss or to Civfanatics website please.

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Quoting csebal,

reply 5

Comparing CIV5 to Elemental is an insult against CIV. "...ain't the same ballpark, ain't the same league, ain't even the same fuckin' sport..."

'nuff said.

CIV V is an insult to strategy gaming. It's just another donkey milking same old game like the past rest with some new TRIX (are for kids like you) nibbles to play with. Go away you bother me boy.

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Who do you think you are, that you can determine what I am?

As long as you post in a public location and express an opinion, you will be judged by it. Deal with it.

Nah, clearly no comparison there. None at all.

Nope, listing flaws is not comparing them to each other as games.

As for the 'notion' of your OP, that is: let's forgive them because 'at least' they were honest about their failures.

That wasn't the "notion of the OP"

EDIT: After reading the rest of your posts, it's obvious you're a troll and I've been feeding you. I should have known better than to reply to you so this will be the last time I bothered with you. Now GTFO.

@rossanderson48: Did you even read before posting?

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Quoting rossanderson48,

reply 14

My point exactly. Let's not get the name of an otherwise great game / franchise dirty by uttering it on these boards. Elemental DOES NOT YET deserve to be written on the same page than that other game (or most other games, for that matter). Let's talk about again this once we have seen the "Elemental: The Release Quality" mini-expansion.

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Please ban that troll ^ above...thanks

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Nah. I think he's fun to watch. You know, like a kitten trying to catch a laser pointer's mark.

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Quoting db0,

reply 16

1 - As long as you post in a public location and express and opinion, you will be judged by it. Deal with it.
2 - Nope, listing flaws is not comparing them to each other as games.
3 - That wasn't the "notion of the OP"

1) You can judge me all day long. They say it makes you e-peen tingle, but quite frankly i dont feel zit.

2) As for your denial of there being comparisons when I clearly quoted you where you did it. Thats just LOL. I guess the terms "X no better than Y", or "X just as bad as Y" are not how people usually compare things.

3) What was the point of your post then, enlighten me? It wasnt comparing the two games. (or so you say) It wasnt explaining how we should not be angry at SD for releasing such a low quality game. (at least not according to you) What was it then? I'm all ears. (eyes actually)

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Quoting rossanderson48,

reply 18

Please ban that troll ^ above...thanks

First, you come here barking at us for discussing something that you do not care about. Then you throw insults around, calling people trolls and now you want to have me banned for participating in a (admittably kinda heated) discussion, whereas all you did was barging in here, like you owned the place and started issuing orders as if anyone should care what you want.

You, sir, should get your facts straight, as right now it is you acting a little out of order and not me.

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after the masterpeice that was civ iv, i cannot believe anyone would defend civ v. can they name a single fun improvement over civ iv?

at least elemental has a future. without a radical design, civ v is going to be remembered like civ iii.

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can they name a single fun improvement over civ iv?

I found the use of hexes and the tactical battles with the one-unit-per hex a brilliant and refreshing change.

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Quoting JayG,

reply 22

after the masterpeice that was civ iv, i cannot believe anyone would defend civ v. can they name a single fun improvement over civ iv?

at least elemental has a future. without a radical design, civ v is going to be remembered like civ iii.

I don't want a "radical redesign" when I buy a franchise game. When I buy civ5 I want it to be pretty much like civ 1 to 4. A "radical redesign" such as MOO2 -> MOO3 sent the entire franchise down the toilet with the 3rd iteration. It wasn't even the same game and it sucked in comparison to MOO2 & MOO1.

If designers want to make a "radical redesign," then they can create a totally different game with a different name. I won't mind.

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Quoting csebal,

reply 21

Quoting rossanderson48,
reply 18
Please ban that troll ^ above...thanks

First, you come here barking at us for discussing something that you do not care about. Then you throw insults around, calling people trolls and now you want to have me banned for participating in a (admittably kinda heated) discussion, whereas all you did was barging in here, like you owned the place and started issuing orders as if anyone should care what you want.

You, sir, should get your facts straight, as right now it is you acting a little out of order and not me.

See he's ^ still trolling. Please ban....thanks.

This forum should be about ELEMENTAL and ELEMENTAL ONLY not about that crappy sorry CIV V game nobody wants to hear about except trolls to this forum.

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