This discussion is way meaningless right now. Those who say doubles r Ok have explained in many different ways why its ok, proven, over and over again that there is no problem.

So I'm going to try to give a solution.

If one of the guys who posted on this topic fells like there is a double or triple that is imba (chose map as well), pls, send me a msg in game, form your "imba" team to face my non doubles or triples team. Whoever wins posts the SC on this topic. Sounds fair to me, and I will go a little further, if u don't find me, send a msg to SoFFacet, face his non "imba" team, I'm pretty sure he will accept the "challenge". The other 2 on my team are Kassaum and Pacov, msgs us anytime.

Actually, the idea of "doubles" being imbalanced can be technically "proven". It is skills that may not align properly, and currently there are none that I have seen. All this thread has proven again is how much casual gamers can whine.

Clearly you don't understand. The concept of "doubles" is easily proven without any kind of metrics using logic. It is the skills that is up for debate, and whether the idea of them being stronger together, than would be a duo of another is the real question. I havn't seen any skills that have super doubly power when worked together, and lol chain grasp isn't that threatening, neither are weak towers.

Discussions like these are useful for thinking about these things in the absence of data, but I doubt that they'll ever be enough to convince anyone to change their mind once they've already made it up, regardless of how many good points are made. Therefore the best way to prove that doubles are or are not OP would be to have a large amount of data regarding the win rates of high level doubled teams, compared to high level non-doubled teams. Of course, that data does not currently exist. However, it is the burden of the anti-double faction to show that they are in fact OP and thus should be banned - in the absence of proof that is the case, we must assume they are not OP. 

The only way to gather data regarding the supposed OP-ness of doubles is to permit their usage. 

Yes, now I understand what u said.

Count me in

I never said anything about "declaring." We've got to start sometime. It's possible as an observant player to make an educated guess whether you are winning/losing due to synergy or teamwork. That's all I'm proposing. Of course there are ton's of variables, that's why I'm trying to simulate a control group by having players switch sides.

I apologize if this has come up before, it's a big thread.

You know how everyone says Sedna is the Queen of 1v1?  Do you think that's because she does so much damage or mitigates almost all of yours?  (Hint - door # 2) 

I think the focus on doing damage when it comes to duplicating abilities is kinda missing the point - the most powerful abilities in the game are about mitigation (the same way they were about control in Beta - you can still get some of the old hands frothing at the mouth when you mention stunlocking or slowstacking), and you will get closer to the ragequit-worthy effects you are looking for when you stop looking at quad sniping and start in on quad Brambleshields.

For 12 cumulative skillpoints a team of 4 Oaks could have 24 seconds of invulnerability on the target of their choice.  At level 7.  That's more than they'll need, though.  I'd probably go with a team of 3 Shield/Penitence/Surge Oaks who stack their priests and all use Cloak of Night and one Bestial/Ooze UB Can-Opener.  Put them on Vent, practice chaining their buffs and debuffs so they don't waste effects or just play them pub, assign everyone a number, and teach them how to count to 6 - "Curly should Shield/Surge/Penitence first, wait six seconds then Larry, wait six seconds then Moe"

Or if you want to be a real set of punks you could play defensive early, upgrade death timer, get your points in Shield, some spirits at base and soul power, get BoTF, Charm of Life, or stack Blood Soaked Wand and a couple of DPS items, and just swarm the enemy citadel with Last Stand at level 8...great way to win a game you shouldn't in less time than it takes your enemy to react..

Point is, duplicating direct offensive abilities like Snipe is going to be less effective than stacking a defensive ability as powerful as Shield...

You could pull this with Sedna's heal or QoT's Bramble or even Erebus Mist too, but while in some cases the abilities are better the DGs won't be as versatile as Oak, imo...

tl;dr - Mitigation is OP when stacked, the same way stunlocking used to be...

Yeah.. even damage on those oaks would be GG for them really. Not to mention what would happen to them when they used all their shield cooldowns. Massive heals with no damage also wont let you take down anyone either. Maximizing the unique builds in each different hero has always been more effective than doubling any skill.

Ultimately, if/when there is some kind of functional "Arranged Team" automatic ladder system, I highly doubt that doubles will be banned.  So you can either play with doubles now and try to find effective counters to overpowered doubles teams, or you can get blindsided by them when you're inevitably matched up against one.

If you hate doubles for whatever reason, then fine, ban it from your custom games.  That's why they're custom.  But a legit ladder system of any significance involves playing against opponents that you cannot preselect.  So however difficult a doubles combo may be to fight against, I'd say either find a way to beat them, or join them, if you're a serious player.

"Its what other people do so it must be right." What a terrible argument. 

I know I'm not really arguing the same point as you guys, but here's the thing:  A few DGs when doubled up require specific DGs, items, skill levels, and/or actions to counter them.  Without pre-game coordination to counter them it takes an unreasonable amount of skill to defeat and hence they are forbidden.

The main example in my experience has been dealing with double regs on a 3v3.  If I do well they resort to simply hitting me with snipe every single cooldown from across the map.  If I don't get heals, I'm either dead, dropping way too much money on potions, or going home to heal over and over again.

I've only had two memorable experiences with double reg and both times I had a general on my side.  The first time I encountered them I was pummeled into the ground and we only won because quite frankly they weren't very good and they needed those snipes to finish anyone but they were alwkeepays on cooldown from keeping me en route to the crystal.  The entire game was frustrating and the win wasn't paritcularly gratifying.

The second other time the EB on my team sent a monk over to my lane and followed me with it a good 80% of the time.  Whenever it would start up a suicide run he would pull it back and whenever  the other team managed to kill it off he'd resummon.  I was able to be aggressive enough to get some kills, bulk up on HP, and shrug off the snipes without his monk when priets hit the field.

It took much more effort on the EB's part to counter the snipes than it did for the Reguli (I propose we all use this word ) and hence if doubles were more frequently allowed it would not generally be fun to play against since having a partner who knows what they're doing is hardly reliable.

So again the real problem is a lack of a proper matching system and the fact that the competitive players are playing in customgames with house rules.  The general community's rules shouldn't apply in high skill level games, but there's currently no distinction between them so you either spend 30 minutes each game finding good opponents, play the way people want to play, or don't play at all.