The 2nd expansion

Quoting Kyle Fesy,

i think you should be able to research a tech that allows you to build phase lane accelerators at each planet so you can jump faster between planets, similar to freelancer with "phase lanes"

The Vasari already have this.

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I'm thinking diplomatic vessels. Like Tradeports except with little missionary vessels that set out to better your diplomatic standing with nearby worlds, spread influence there, or maybe even pursuade unclaimed worlds to your cause. However, each race percieves diplomacy in a different way. The Vasari oppress and control, the Advent create Unity and indoctrinate and the TEC are a little more traditional, talk and guns.

So the Vasari could use warships as a means of diplomacy. Stealth vessels (based on the Vasari sup. tech and phase tech) that move in to de-stabilize governments below. Big vessels or fleets of awesome power that stun an enemy planet into submission, especially dependant on the "Loyalty" score of the planet. And perhaps weakly, teh Vasari could have mercy vessels, little fleets of Vasari refugees that mean to escape the oncoming threat and therefore strengthen diplomatic standing between your species by slightly increasing the population of some of the opponent's planets.

The TEC obviously hate both the Advent and the Vasari. They are also vastly less technologically advanced. That said, they were also a peaceful people for a very long time. I think they could have epsionage geared toward the stealing of foreign technology. At a cost, perhaps by researching a series of technology called "Appropriate Foreign Technology", the TEC could use diplomats (or vessels or spies) to steal a technology from another species. The number of techs able to be stolen would be as many as the number of "Appropriate" techs. It would be neccessary for the TEC to research a stolen tech to use it. In this way, the TEC could get superior mining, shields, armour, weapons or even the vessels of other players. Perhaps there should be extra cost to building a foreign vessel. Perhaps it should be weaker than normal. Perhaps the bonus to foreign shield augments, etc should be halved. Also, with the built foreign vessel, maybe you could sneak into another players space and pretend to be one of the fleet (by means of "Join Fleet" or something), giving you an spy within their ranks. The TEC should also have a very strong traditional diplmacy. Vessels which can go from world to world and strengthen diplomacy between species: for a cost, increasing the rate at which that opponent gives you a mission to be completed, getting the opponent to give you a different mission [in the case that the current mission is against your current operations]. Now, teh diplomatic vessel certainly could not have sight for your empire or esle it would certainly be destroyed. It's presence could increase money generation (something the TEC are great at) for the opponent's world. However, the vessel could be controlled remotely with researchable abilities like "Steal Technology" and "Cultural Insurrection" (galciv, yeah) or "Plantary Loyalty De-stabilization" or "Propagnda Warfare" or "Planetary Vision" (in short burst like Clairvoyance, ie an shirt untraceable signal sent via encryption), also a kind of passive aggressive political espionage that I think the TEC would go for. Vasari specfic distruptions could be related to anti-phase space use, Advent specific could be anti culture and anti TEC could be anti money/resource.

The Advent are all about the Unity and so like a religious zealot would probably try and sell their faith to their opponents or at worst simple just take control of the population's mind. This makes me think of the Advent a bit like the plague. Maybe the Unity could be like a diplomatic disese that can be spread into a system and slowly take control of entire enemy fleets and even planets. The "Unity" vessel could take control of enemy vessels for short and sustainable periods of time forgoing all kinds of weapons. To suggest taking over capitol ships is probably a no-no, but maybe let's say ten of them could do it. Furthermore (perhaps by 9th lvl reastearch) the "Unity vessel could take control of enemy planets, similar to purge vessels, except without the need for killing off the enemy planet. Alternatively, the Advent need even more culture spreading stuff. On the lesser aggressive "mind-contolly" side of things could be prophet vessels, Advent of a reputedly different colour (harmony), that bring happiness to Vasari in helping them avoid their fate and to TEC by appealing to human sense of mysitism and fortune telling. The prophets could boost your cultural advance while incresing monetary output for your opponent (by giving them a better moral state, I too would be happier if I knew how to not get hit by that bus on Tuesday).

Another idea I've got leads to commanders and ambassadors abord capitol ships. The Vasari commander could create a strong oppressive increase in influence, fleet power, phase jumping, missile penetration, etc. The Advent commander might create additional abilities on capitol ships at an antimatter cost subject to the personal MP of the commander or the vessel's supply or both (ie Vengeance on a Radiance, Amplify Energy Aura on a Progenitor - all in the aim of creating perfect Advent fleet versatility). The TEC commander might add to income, ship building speed fleet power and inspiration but most certainly: resolve, something that would boost the damage mitigation on shields, boost HP, and allow vessels at even 0 HP to fight for moments longer. Commanders might also be more passive, like Vasari commanders of oppression and fear, Advent commanders with Clairvoyance, boosted phase detection and influence push, and TEC commanders may be tech stealers and specialist espionage intelligence commanders. The commanders don't need names persay, but titles like Admiral or Mistress. Names can be given and assigned automatically much like cap. ships. The presence of commanders would make Sins feel almost like a real story. And where you place these incredible few could have huge signifigance (I imagine that a system for getting them might go, 1 per homeworld, and then 1 per every five planets captured thereafter. Commanders may be placed on worlds or capitol ships. If the world is taken or ship is destroyed the commander may try to escape, if his/her/its ship it destroyed, the commander is killed and cannot be replaced. That is to say the sommander has a ship. Perhaps some do and some don't. Perhaps some have great ones that escape very quickly. And some don't have a vessel at all and are killed after their planet or ship is taken out. )

I think a governmental style would massively affect the diplomacy in the game. A Pascifist Government could not take any offensive action (defensive yes) at all without a vote by its citizenry (which could take up to five minutes, let's say, to complete), would have stricter mine regulations, would rebel on you if you broke a peace treaty, etc. For this you would receive a boost to culture, economy, research be given the option of construction diplomatic vessels like a TEC Ambassador or an Advent Prophet or a Vasari Refugee Fleet and peace and culture based commanders. And the option to construct the civ tech at a faster rate or perhaps a free bonus lvl of civ tech without the required building. A Technological/Resource/Financial Government would give bonus tech lvls without required bulidings, faster research or better money/resource income and tech/resource based commanders. A Conquesting Government would give access to war vessels faster, better shields, better weapons, better fleet supply, war based commanders.

Well, that exhausts all of my ideas. These are big changes of course, and many are a bit crazy. But when we're talking 4X real time massive massive game like this, I think its good to dream big.

Peace

+1

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Hello Carbunkyl!

Hey, good thinking there. I especially like the idea of a camouflaged ship joining the ranks of an enemy fleet. This could be awesome!

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yeah, i agree with above, there needs to be more missions, and maybe more mission conditions/rewards, such as, i want you to destroy 6 civilian structures, and ill give you 500 credits 50 metal and 50 crystal for every military sturcture u destroy, 1000 for every cap ship and ill like you more if you damage more stuff

and yes, there needs to be more random events, pirates shutting down trade lanes maybe give them a special ship that makes a GW in the middle of a trade lane so that your trade routes are interrupted and (small?) fleets are destroyed and you dont know what happened? maybe have missions to loan control of certain forces for a certain battle, like, give me control of 10 of your Ogrov Destroyers for this amount of time, or assist me in this battle, even defend this planet for X minutes etc, im sure the devs will think of heaps of ideas.

also make it that instead of just destroying militia forces, you can negotiate with them for a bonus tribute fee or cheaper production/research something... maybe special tech, but you have to protect them etc... and if a soverign nation in your empire is attacked enough times they shift alliances and turn to attack you... or if enough soverign planets are destroyed by an enemy, all other soverigns in your empire revolt and begin attacking you etc?

i like the idea of specialised planets, though you could always leave the planet specification open to get the most efficient blend of bonuses, like, i always like using desert planet for military strongholds and fleet manufactories etc, so changing the spec adds planet based space cannons (or even orbital guns, like a ring around the planet to give 360 degree coverage to a certain distance...) also have more tactical spaces, higher planet health, more space mine slots, perhaps even have specialised tech for each type of world, so stronghold planets have a special device that slows inbound and outbound enemies, much like a combined starbase/phase inhibitor structure... while trade planets have structures that monitor all cargo and ships etc that increases effeciency and value of your economy, maybe have a structure that is the opposite of the phase inhibitor and lets your ships jump out quicker and move faster?

someone said that a player who builds up diplomatically should be as strong as someone with a strong military, i like te idea, you could theoretically have a very small fleet, and instead ask that your allies do all your bullying for you, that way, you have a true empire, and the military guy is too afraid to attack you for fear of being nailed by your subsidiaries... or else hes just so stupid that he does it anyway. on this point, id like AI players to heed your directions more, like, i had a huge battle going on between me and 5 hard AI players, 3 on their team and me and another AI, i couldnt have won by myself, i told my ally to go in to the battle and then i was going to follow... he waited until i finally jumped, and not a short while after, he came about 5 mins after which is long enough for mot of my fleet to take a real beating. that way, you would be able to co-ordinate your allies better

on a side note, its no so much the non-military bit, but i noticed that, aside from the fact that not even insane AI use their super weapons against me, if a human player wanted to attack my super weapons before i fired them, they would have to fight their way all the way into my central (and i use central figurateively, usually they are the planets with only one way in or out and you have to go through alot of my other planets to get there first) planets to detroy it, by which time they are either detstroyed, heavily damaged, or ive fired the superweapon already anyway... i mean, sometimes i get bored and just build a novalith in every GW and wipe the enemy out from range, and they cant do much about it, so maybe something needs to be devised to stop the superweapons firing? maybe if enough of your planets are under enemy culture you cant fire due to public opinion, maybe the spy ship mentioned above can double to sabotage firing? maybe even with enough research make it that when u try to fire our superweapon it overloads and is destroyed? or maybe make it that superweapons can fire on other super weapons, destroying them, though u need scout data to do that?

anyway, thats all the ideas i have atm

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One important thing i forgot in my earlier posts:

More modding freedom:

It seems that a lot of mods have cool ideas that cannot implemented by nowcause some things i the game are hardoded.

eg. planetbonues you can only manipulate the existing modifiers. (as far as i know)

but it seems not possible to create a planet bonus that increases the fleetcap or decreases the research cost, this

can only be done with new researches.

there are surly a lot of other examples for limitations of modding.

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I would like to see a "game time" clock(one that is consistent too). We don't expect planets to be populated in seconds and star cluster conquered in 10 hours in the first place, but it'd be nice to see game time as the devs imagine it. At the moment, I cant get a sense whether i've guided my empire for decades or a month, or what!

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some nice ideas, a bunch of them have surfaced every now and again like the planet invasions or alternative victory conditions. and as stated I am also a fan of different government types. makes for some interesting advantages and trade-offs.

also, I still say no to uber ships. not only, because a diplomacy pack doesn't seem the right place, but because I don't see the point. I guess I was just never the type who likes 'manage to build this super unit and win'. yeah, capships could be stronger, or rather, there could be something in that range with firepower and survivability to not be insta destroyed by late game fleets, but those superships just aren't the answer for me.

probably a lot depends on how they would be realised and utilised. tbh, the superweapons we have now are fine. they are very expensive to get to and to build, take up loads of space, but they have their use. they are good game-enders and help a lot in attacking a well-defended enemy position. but they are not uber game-enders and alone they are worthless. powerful, but you need to know how to use them and need the fleet to really make exploit the advantage. and that's ok with me and if a supercap ship class were designed such - strong, yes, but with a very specific role and a limit to their use - I'd also be fine. but the concept alone of 'cost a lot, but is a mobile decimation machine' alone doesn't cut it. and don't anyone say 'but it could be vulnerable to squads.' it's not enough.

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Quoting Carbunkyl,

reply 2

Another idea I've got leads to commanders and ambassadors abord capitol ships. The Vasari commander could create a strong oppressive increase in influence, fleet power, phase jumping, missile penetration, etc. The Advent commander might create additional abilities on capitol ships at an antimatter cost subject to the personal MP of the commander or the vessel's supply or both (ie Vengeance on a Radiance, Amplify Energy Aura on a Progenitor - all in the aim of creating perfect Advent fleet versatility). The TEC commander might add to income, ship building speed fleet power and inspiration but most certainly: resolve, something that would boost the damage mitigation on shields, boost HP, and allow vessels at even 0 HP to fight for moments longer. Commanders might also be more passive, like Vasari commanders of oppression and fear, Advent commanders with Clairvoyance, boosted phase detection and influence push, and TEC commanders may be tech stealers and specialist espionage intelligence commanders. The commanders don't need names persay, but titles like Admiral or Mistress. Names can be given and assigned automatically much like cap. ships. The presence of commanders would make Sins feel almost like a real story. And where you place these incredible few could have huge signifigance (I imagine that a system for getting them might go, 1 per homeworld, and then 1 per every five planets captured thereafter. Commanders may be placed on worlds or capitol ships. If the world is taken or ship is destroyed the commander may try to escape, if his/her/its ship it destroyed, the commander is killed and cannot be replaced. That is to say the sommander has a ship. Perhaps some do and some don't. Perhaps some have great ones that escape very quickly. And some don't have a vessel at all and are killed after their planet or ship is taken out. )

I think a governmental style would massively affect the diplomacy in the game. A Pascifist Government could not take any offensive action (defensive yes) at all without a vote by its citizenry (which could take up to five minutes, let's say, to complete), would have stricter mine regulations, would rebel on you if you broke a peace treaty, etc. For this you would receive a boost to culture, economy, research be given the option of construction diplomatic vessels like a TEC Ambassador or an Advent Prophet or a Vasari Refugee Fleet and peace and culture based commanders. And the option to construct the civ tech at a faster rate or perhaps a free bonus lvl of civ tech without the required building. A Technological/Resource/Financial Government would give bonus tech lvls without required bulidings, faster research or better money/resource income and tech/resource based commanders. A Conquesting Government would give access to war vessels faster, better shields, better weapons, better fleet supply, war based commanders.

Well, that exhausts all of my ideas. These are big changes of course, and many are a bit crazy. But when we're talking 4X real time massive massive game like this, I think its good to dream big.

Peace

I don`t like the idea of stealthed units - in my experience such units always come off as gimmicky, but for the original Supreme Commander system (i.e. visual proximity always reveals the unit). A stealthed unit requires a stealthed unit detector... and then you`re down that slippery slope of specialization. I`d be very leery of such things.

Your Ambassador and diplomat character ideas are excellent. Love to see such. It would introduce another layer of play to the game; I think they ought to be independent of fleet actions though, as in not ship-based, simply ambient assets you dispatch/recruit/counter.

Governmental style has potential, though I would restrict such to non-player factions. I believe each player faction (Vasari, Advent, TEC) are already defined as to what style of governance they possess. Changing that would be against the grain of the mythology. Still, a good idea for every other entity - some will like you more than others (!).

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I have a few ideas, some of which are built up on others i have seen....

Joint Planet control

When you capture a planet it takes time to colonize it, e.g instead of 100% colonisation it takes say 5 minutes to cononise, this allows another player to colonise it, regardless if they're neutral/enemy/ally etc, and then splitting the difference, e.g someone who gets 20% of the planet gets 20% of taxes, 20% of slots etc. (However both would be responcible for building up their own buildings/infrastructure etc.) - If you didn't like the guy next to you - you could always bomb them out of existance (for that planet).

Also if you have an ally you can allocate them a percentage of your planet of your choosing, or of alliance conditions (see NATO alliance etc)

Neutral planets are not just dead voids.

Some "neutral" planets are not really that neutral and have their own governments and agendas, e.g they could be put into alliances, and build alliances of their own with other natural neutral planets or other players/alliances, build their own infrastructure and fleets etc, however they would have a certain limit on their expansion and fleets, and would be defensive in nature, however they could attack planets local to them (but not take them over) e.g max 10 planets in a 100 planet system - to make sure that they are still a minor " AI player".

Also you could use them similar to pirates, by funding them, or in other ways, by purchasing planets off them (if you didn't want to outright anhilolate them - e.g this could be cheaper if you have culture spreading through their empire). Also you may be able to build units cheaper on their worlds (if they can auto-build structures) due to forced labour, e.g vessari forced labour upgrade, if you dominated them culturally, even if they wern't offically under your control. This could also be a good excuse to allow you to impliment the "rule from orbit" structures of the vassari.

Ability for "NATO type" alliance

This means that as part of the alliance, you can set certain members conditions, e.g a condition takes 10% of everyones income and distributes it/stores it for a set period of time. This could be done by say having 5 players in an alliance, the conditions would be set by how many people agree, e.g if 3 people agree, and 2 don't then a condition is set - like a voting system, this could be done for joining, resources distribution etc.

If someone is tasks with building up their military force for the alliance, then they could request 20% of all peoples incomes per second to buffer the costs (this could be done by decreasing the overal cost of the said military players vehicle costs by 20% of the overal alliance income - meaning that they can't just take the money and spend it on something else.) - This could be further done by having the player buy units, but that they are built from individual members planets (e.g 5 players each having 5 planets each which can build ships all build on their worlds simutaniously (25 planets in total for alliance, making 25 planet vehicle outputs), giving balanced control and building up the fleet in a reasonable ammount of time since its an alliance, as it pools the alliances resources together. This could also be useful if certain people want to concentrate on non-military while others want to be militaristic and not have to keep defending their backs.

The alliance could also set a certain fleet logistics percentage for alliances which is weighted/averaged, meaning that it would not max out members with lower fleet logistics. The fleet could then be controled by certain members, who are voted in, while others upgrade research et al both individually and for the alliance, if the alliance is broken up, then the fleets go back to their original owners, and the technology is individualised for the person who bought it. Phase stabalisers would also be allowed to be used as part of the alliance.

On the AI side of this, the fleets would need to be programed to help eachother, even if the races are different, e.g HC (TEC) would help a enforcer (Vassari) automatically (not sure if they do this now already however)

Vehicles get experience.

Althought its not diplomatic, it could be useful.

Its not what you know, its who you know

By this i mean that you can't make an across the star system/galaxy alliance without actually meeting them first (unless its a NATO alliance, then you would only have to find one) with their planets, maby the previously stated diplomatic ship would be good for this (e.g at start of game you can't have an alliance with people you have never seen or met in game). - This avoids players ganging up on people at start because they're your mates.

Other not so diplomatic stuff.

Infrastructure actually appears on your planet when its built giving the planet a more life like appearance (it would be good if you could see them getting destroyed aswel when being attacked)

Others, which other members have said, with graphics showing evacuation planets etc - i believe these could be turned into controlable ships and used to boost other planets population/living numbers (others have probably said).

Some kind of ground force/space marine ship cologniser, this would allow you to colognise a planet without bombing it, leaving the infrastructure intact (so you don't have to re-build it) - This presence could also be used to quell uprisings if placed on distant planets, helping to minimise your planets being overthrown by hostile culture.They could also be used to board/capture other ships/structures, e.g if the targets shields are down and disabled by a subverter etc - however to counter this - the other vehicle can have military personel on theirs, (meaning that for some it would not just be a streight take over) maby some kind of upgrade for it or so, to allow all vehicles/structures have some kind of military presence within them - with further upgrades increasing military numbers and combat training etc. The military would cost money and could only be created at a military planet (which others have surgested e.g military planet type)

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There are some really cool ideas here!

I second the idea of more planet types and moons. Moons could be based as a massive resource boost (metal and crystal).

How about an Ambassador class cap ship? A ship that carries no weapons but has loads of powerful diplomacy ablities, used for more remote allies?

I think spies is a good idea but not to go to far (like galciv 2 did) as I don't think they should be able to shut a planet down - just cause a real pain.

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A special ship that carries a fleet admiral ,if that ship is destroyed the entire fleet gets a penalty of some type. So the idea would be too hide the ship in a out of the way well and your enemy would have to find it.

These ships would never be towards the front lines, always in the back. It would take maybe 5 to ten minutes to promote your new admiral.

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Some thoughts:

Mining and influence starbases to go with the existing, keeping the one per gravity well limit so you have to choose.

Maybe random leaders are spawned that can be assigned to posts, fleet, starbase, or planet. They would attributes such as diplomat (increased local influence), tactics (increased fleet speed and repair rate or some other combo), Engineering (mining and defense increase), and orginzation (increased economy). The persons would be spawned at random times and on random planets. The person would have to travel to any location in a transport so they will be vulnerable, especially if trying to flee a siege. Research for acadamies and traing centers can increase the birthrate of these persons.

I like the idea of assigned missions to be more "act like my ally and assist me here".

Spy research could enable vision of nearby worlds.

Worlds under your influence but enemy owned will have defenses function at lower percentage and a percentage of the population would remain after invasion.

Thanks - J

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The cap ships should be bigger

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I miss Gaia planets ie planets that are even more lush and beautiful than earth... Rare but with amazing bonuses.

(also Gaia planets could be sentient and resent certain types of colonists - techs would need to be developped, empathy skills or so to colonize them)

Alternative winning conditions - It feels sad to commit a genocide to win a game . Why not bring back the Galactic Council of MooII which allows winning through popular votes.

Diplomacy - I want to be able to ask other players for planets, technology, slaves (eheheh), money, etc...

A 4th race - focused on less aggressive winning strategy such as terraforming and colonization (albeit with strong defense and reproductive capacities)

Small stealth ships (to carry spies / disrupt trade routes) maybe as a an-add to existing ships (scouts and cruisers)

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How about a timer for combined attacks. You suggest an attack on a specified gravwell to an ally. Then you suggest a timepoint (1min, 2 min, 3 min from now on...) and then a timer counts down the agreed time. That way, one could better coordinate attacks. Would work well for both multi player and single player matches...

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It feels sad to commit a genocide to win a game

I agree. Would be nice to take over a planet without just killing everyone.

Perhaps it could be implemented in the spy system. If you are able to place a cloaked infiltrator next to a planet (and the relevant tech has been researched) you can pay a certain amount of money and -depending on the tech grade (or race)- decrease the loyality by financing underground movements, resistances etc. This can finally result into a switch of owner (after a long period of time, otherwise it might be too powerfull.. Let's give the enemy a change to detect the spy vessel...). It might be a bit difficult to explain why a planet of one race starts to convert to another side, but then alliences seems to switch very fast, too...

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It has been mentioned several times, that introduction of new planets would be nice. Of course, there is the eye candy factor, but this might not be enough to justify it's introduction in an expansion (especially, as there are mods out there which adress this topic)

Thus, which kind of planets would you like and what effects do you think they will have?

Right now, terran planets can be colonized by everyone, the volcanic and ice planets need research before colonization.

A Gaia planet has been mentioned by Gliesse581c. This could result in huge amounts of citizens and thus tax income.

A water planet: Right now, I have no clue why we could need a waterplanet... Ok, eye candy, vacations... Or research bonus...

Gas planet: It has been mentioned in other posts. Use them similair like the cloud harvesters in "Saga of the seven suns". Build refineries in low orbit, which harvest the gas planet for a specific resource. As I have serious doubts about the introduction of an additional resource into the game (as the costs of the current ships are already balanced and we should not abandon this working system), I would suggest to make the harvested resource race specific. Tec gains additional money (buy selling harvested gas), Advent gains metal, Vasari harvests crystal (from the deep core of the planet). Perhaps, they could have another effect. Those huge giants distort any sensors, thus any fleet close to a gas planet can't be detected until a scout enter's the grav well. Perhaps it also lowers the shield points...

Lagrange points. Empty spaces, which can't be colonized. However, one can build factories in them and thus gets a build time boost (ships are produced faster).

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Or maybe we could have a new race who their main thing is diplomacy. They could be a kind of organic race because we hav eyet to see an organic race in the game and it could hgelp explane the Vasari backstory in a way like this.

The new race came acrossa planey ( vasari ) and try and make peace with them but they are betrayed. So they hunt them down and when they discover the other two races they try and make peace with them but it does not work so they try and get some of the outer colonies to join them in their fight. Their ships could have a control ability as well as a cease fire ability ( both are already in the game)

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I really like the idea of adding new planets,

Here are a few possibilities:

- Gaia: could have 400+ population, but only 1 metal & 1 crystal asteroids
- Ocean: could be colonized, but only by TEC (after research)
- Swamp: could have 100+ population, population growth: +25%
- Tundra: could have 200+ population, population growth: -25%
- Barren: could be colonized, but only by Advent (after research)
- Radiation: could be colonized, but only by Vasari (after research)

And why not add different size to planets:

For example: Terran planets

- Tiny: -50% population, Tactical: 25, Logistics: 16
- Small: -25% population, Tactical: 30, Logistics: 20
- Medium: current planet, Tactical: 35, Logistics: 24
- Large: +25% population, Tactical: 40, Logistics: 28
- Huge: +50% population, Tactical: 45, Logistics: 32

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I too would like to voice my support for re-vamping the missions. I too would like to see AI happyness with me influenced by non-mission actions. If I come to the rescue of an AI's colony, I'd like them to be a little more happy with me. Even if it is just a few percentile points. Give me something!

As far as things missing from Sins, I think Intel is the biggest one. When running an empire, I want as much information about my opponents as possible.

In Sins, I picture this tab in the diplomacy window for Intelligence. (The tab would be greyed out until you research the necessary tech.) Switching to that tab would show you what info you currently have on your opponents, as well as how old the information is. There would also be sliders or up/down arrows where you can choose how much (in percentile) money to devote to gathering intel. Some effects off the top of my head could be:

Treaties - Discover your oppenents' current deals with one another. Who is allied with whom? Who is the enemy of my enemy? Of all the effects, this is the one I want the most.
Planet Vision - Your hidden spies report back on what is going on around an enemy world. The effect could be just the same as a scout probe, only lasts a shorter time. Maybe at first the target is random, but with higher Intel tech you can choose the world.
Ship Vision - Your spies have snuck aboard an enemy cap ship, reporting its movements for a short period of time. Like Planet Vision, but with a ship.
Counter Intel - If there are going to be spies running around, we should get the chance to stop them. Find out what information has been revealed to the enemy. Defeat enemy spy operations.

Another idea I'd like to support is capturing worlds. Specifically, I'd like to be able to invade with ground troops. Each troopship would have a certain number of Troop Units. The defending colony would get Troop Units based on its population. The invasion status would be shown in the planet's info as how many Troop Units each side has left. Both defending and attacking player would be able to drop additional troops during an invasion. Though to make things easier, a third player would have to wait until the two have finished fighting before landing troops of his own.

What about adjustable strength for the independent forces? Those units that start the game inhabiting all the gravity wells, the grey non-pirate ones. I'd like the option to increase/decrease how many are out there. Something you could do during game setup. Perhaps there could be a scale, labeled 0-5 with 3 being the current strength. At 0, there are NONE out there (colonizing free-for-all!). At 5, you'll need your flagship just to colonize a new world safely (though imagine the experience you'll rack up).

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Quoting BrikLeader,

reply 20

I too would like to voice my support for re-vamping the missions. I too would like to see AI happyness with me influenced by non-mission actions. If I come to the rescue of an AI's colony, I'd like them to be a little more happy with me. Even if it is just a few percentile points. Give me something!

As far as things missing from Sins, I think Intel is the biggest one. When running an empire, I want as much information about my opponents as possible.

In Sins, I picture this tab in the diplomacy window for Intelligence. (The tab would be greyed out until you research the necessary tech.) Switching to that tab would show you what info you currently have on your opponents, as well as how old the information is. There would also be sliders or up/down arrows where you can choose how much (in percentile) money to devote to gathering intel. Some effects off the top of my head could be:

Treaties - Discover your oppenents' current deals with one another. Who is allied with whom? Who is the enemy of my enemy? Of all the effects, this is the one I want the most.
Planet Vision - Your hidden spies report back on what is going on around an enemy world. The effect could be just the same as a scout probe, only lasts a shorter time. Maybe at first the target is random, but with higher Intel tech you can choose the world.
Ship Vision - Your spies have snuck aboard an enemy cap ship, reporting its movements for a short period of time. Like Planet Vision, but with a ship.
Counter Intel - If there are going to be spies running around, we should get the chance to stop them. Find out what information has been revealed to the enemy. Defeat enemy spy operations.
Another idea I'd like to support is capturing worlds. Specifically, I'd like to be able to invade with ground troops. Each troopship would have a certain number of Troop Units. The defending colony would get Troop Units based on its population. The invasion status would be shown in the planet's info as how many Troop Units each side has left. Both defending and attacking player would be able to drop additional troops during an invasion. Though to make things easier, a third player would have to wait until the two have finished fighting before landing troops of his own.

What about adjustable strength for the independent forces? Those units that start the game inhabiting all the gravity wells, the grey non-pirate ones. I'd like the option to increase/decrease how many are out there. Something you could do during game setup. Perhaps there could be a scale, labeled 0-5 with 3 being the current strength. At 0, there are NONE out there (colonizing free-for-all!). At 5, you'll need your flagship just to colonize a new world safely (though imagine the experience you'll rack up).

agreed

I would also like a new approach to the pirate bidding war, I really hate babysitting this thing, especially when i'm in a battle. I feel like I have to stop colonizing/attacking/planning just to make sure they don't attack me!.

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Not sure if it is mentioned, fleet controls, with respect to fleet formations, graphics update, planetary bonues, new artifacts

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To: Blair Fraiser from Ironclad,

There is a lot of fluff in these suggestions, but a lot of good ones I hope you will implement that said, some of these suggestions are not realistic. I wanted to give a run-down of the most significant ideas.

Quoting GHenrikG,

reply 1

1: Trading planets/ships between players

Sth like a trading system would be nice. You can give planets or ships to other players. I don't know if tech trading should be allowed. If so, a lot of players will have the exact same mixed techs at the end of a large game... No, I don't think tech trading is a good idea, it would just blur the feeling of the different races...

2: Spying/sabotage

A spying system would be cool. You could sabotage the assembly of an enemy capital ship (the factory needs longer to build a capital ship; perhaps with an upgradeable research tech: the better you are in it, the longer it will take the enemy to build this ship) or structure. To prevent it from being a game breaker, I would suggest to introduce a cloaked spy ship, which needs to be in the system you want to sabotage. This spy ship can be detected via scouts and then being destoyed. That way you could bother your enemy a bit, without breaking him completely.

Trading planets as a diplomacy feature would be nice, as it can prevent an ally from being wiped out and then usually in MP, the other players end up auto-quitting after that. I believe it is realistic and hopefully simple to implement. +1

Spying would be hard to implement and balance. if the opponent doesn't like being spied on how does he counter it? Scout ships are good enough to simply scout, and spying would add too much headache and micromanagement.

Quoting Farsight84,

reply 25

one thing that would be interesting to see is tech sharing that allowed for mixed tech prototypes like ships and/or structures, it would also add more temptation to forming alliances.

Horrible idea, not only will this be a programmer's nighmare, but it would DESTROY the uniqueness of the races. There is no point of unique ships and tech if everyone has the potential to get everything.

Quoting Phalnax811,

reply 19

I want super big ships....meaning a combination of super weapons and starbases. A very expensive ship not build in a factory but in orbit of a planet. But then again, you would have to increase the scope of the entire game in order to pull that off....

Flak turrets on ALL Cap Ships

-Phalnax

I really like the idea, but for the THIRD EXPANSION, where it would focus on combat. Give each faction a Yamato-like super-battleship type capital ship, that has very good anti-strike craft abilities.

Currently, carrier/ strike craft spamming is ruining this game as there is no counter to it except for spamming you own carrier/strike craft. Instead of making all ships have flak, make cap ships take less dmg from strike craft (15%) and make the Flak Frigate viable. Flak frigates alone can save the meta-game if they can just be buffed to wipe out Strike Craft effectively.

Quoting GHenrikG,

reply 1

Here you go, everyone! That's what I like about Ironclad & Stardock! They are listening to the community...

Ok, I love the ideas posted here.

A:Some random events a là GalCivII would be cool (could mean sth like a star is about to become a supernova, destroying the closets planets in the process; an alien artifact is entering the system and the one who controls it gains special abilities; etc...)

B:How about being able to evacuate the population of a planet and distributing the people over the remaining planets. Your planet is about to fall and the citizens start an exodus. The people would be redistibuted to fill up the population of other planets to their maximum. If the number gets higher then that, you are dealing with special consequences like reduced tax income fom those planets because of refugee management and perhaps social unrest. However, the less planets you have, the higher their moral, because they start to really fight for their lifes (there is no other place to go...) which might result in increased attack values of your ships... Might be difficult to balance, but perhaps sth to keep in mind...

C:I love the idea of a mother ship class (I have posted it somewhere else already... ). Have one ship per player, which dwarfs the capital ships (I am thinking along Star Wars). This ship can be equipped with a limited amount of researchable moduls, which can be destroyed in combat. Those modules can be exchanged at the "mother ship factory" (for lack of a better word...) for a price. But I guess, this is not really an idea for a diplomatic expansion... (well, it enhances your negotiation skills to some degree, I guess... "I see your point, now let me show you mine...")

D: Taking planets over without killing the whole population would be cool. It needs to be more time consuming than bombarding a planet back into the stone age. Otherwise, no one is using the planetary bombardement anymore, which would make several ships useless... I personally would like to have some dropships with troopers. They should have no weaponry thus they can't be used for actual space combat. You need to have a special percentage of soldiers compared to a planet's population (There might be some ground troop equipment researchable, which enhances your chances to take over a planet. And of course some fitting counter measures to them). Perhaps those can be used (after some research) as boarding parties to dissable/take over enemy ships. But again, maybe not the stuff for a non military expansion.

E: Distinct victory conditions have been mentioned. Well, I think this would be cool. Let's make an on adn off button for it, because not everyone might like it (like there is one for the pirates). You would win automatically, if you control 75% of all the planets. You might win if your cultural influence has reached 90% of the map. If you have two tradeports in 50% of the planets, you win an economic victory. Sth along these lines (Sorry, I am a GalCiv fan... )

F: I think the idea of being able to slightly focus your planets on sth is pretty cool (the tech, economic and industrial capital a là GalCiv have been mentioned above. That's an awsome idea!). Perhaps each planet has two focusing slots in which you can build some specials... I am only worried, that all this stuff is slowly turning the game into a totally different, hugely micromanaging nighmare in the long run...

I love all these ideas, all of this would go towards making SoaSE into very sophisticated game. I really like the random events idea with the ability to turn them off.

-Solar Flare, common in the star and systems immediately around it giving ships (but not structures) moderate damage over time. They can always jump out of the system.

-Super Nova, a rare stronger Solar flare doing moderately-high dmg to nearby ships.

-Globalization: Culture effects get accelerated by 200% for 15 minutes. (vs. Xenopobia)

-Economic boom: You get 80% more credits for 15 minutes, happens only once par player, at random times for each player.

... etc.

Technology and Cultural Victory options such as in GalCiv2 would be welcomed and be sophisticated.

Quoting Astax,

reply 8

Ok since Blair is readign this. I would like a Diplomacy Frigate, that can perform various things in SP, but more importantly for MP it would allow you to survey planets for bonuses. That way you would know what you get ahead of time. Knowing would make it attractive to use planet exploration in competative MP.

Planet Exploration should be more useful for more than a flip of a coin for artifacts, BUT this new diplomacy ship idea is redundant and not very imaginative. A scout ship can explore and possibly a science ship (also acting as a mobile science lab) would make far more sense.

Quoting Armaneus,

reply 17

Someone suggested capturing planets without completely destroying the infrastructure. What if the culture-producing buildings "converted" planets to your cause? Everyone on the planet completely rebels and joins the "liberating" forces, instead of sitting apathetically at home waiting for a colony ship to come and bring new colonists. Whether the buildings already there convert as well or not can be discussed.

I also like the idea of the pirates being more of their own faction instead of free experience points.Maybe they should have small bands that roam around, moving from planet to planet, instead of waiting at base until someone puts enough money on someone else to induce them to attack. They're more like mercenaries right now. You pay them, they fight. You don't pay them, they fight you. Attacking one of the roving bands of pirates would give you resources, because you would recover whatever money or goods they've taken from their hapless victims. Also, they'd try to head for more unguarded planets, instead of the nearest one.

Customizable ships sound cool. I wouldn't mind being able to choose from a collection of upgrades, instead of having only a few available.

just building on other people's ideas.

Culture should be more powerful in this game. Planets should be given a random chance to flip to the other side whenever their own culture gets critically low making a culture push strat a real strategy. A strong culture should also give you domestic advantages such as increased tax base modifer on top of civilian infrastructure upgrades, ability to put more profitable longer trade routes (tourism) and lower cost to pay off pirate bounties. Culture should add a whole stack of small modifers to everything that is non-combat making it worth getting culture.

Pirates should level up (as in get better ships) with time, so in mid-late-game they can actually fight instead of getting slaughtered automatically.

Lastly, the custom-ship idea is horrible. It will be a programmer's nightmare and a huge balance problem. Nobody will start to use the NON custom-ships and the reason why this feature is only implemented in games like Alpha Centauri and GalCiv 2 is because they are single-player only. It really cannot work in SoaSE and it will be a major major undertaking for Ironclad if they decide to implement this design and other features would suffer.

Other ideas, Please consider them.

A. There should be a planetary assault option that is faster than simple planetary (also have the possiblitiy of failing) bombardment and have the advantage of having some of the remaining population be alive upon capture. Planetary bombardment should be an (major) added modifer to the assault force, but because there are no troop transport ships in SoaSE this would require added them or have troops already be a part of capital ships.

B. Moons, some planets should be able to have 1 asteriod like moon (such as Mar's Phobas) to act like another regular/or dead asteriod.

C. Nebula, instead of just lightening clouds or dead roids in uninhabitable sectors, there should also be Nebulas which effectively cloaks ships inside it. Ships will be in only manuel-fire mode while within this. These are great for staging areas for fleets.

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a 4th race iv seen asked for, but who or what could they be? a machine race? they've been done to death in every other space orientated thing iv seen, or a random alien race, more little green men style than humanoid looking

but where would they have come from? why have they suddenly appeared in trader space? an suddenly get dragged into a 3 way war thats been going on for some time.

poor TEC another front on which to fight, they really dont have anything going for them do they?

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Though the psi claim to be a 'unity', that doesn't have to preclude a variety of government styles. A monarchy could be a caste-based 'unity', an authoritarian government a psi-meritocracy and an anarchy a deviant 'unity'. Federation is harder but perhaps one form of 'unity' might require social diversity at lower planetary government levels to encourage mental prowess. A republic might be the most difficult to rationalise, then the 'unity' would only apply to the military guardian elite, whether or not they were also in secret control of the society. The other types of faction seem more flexible in terms of government types.

It might add variety to have slightly different sizes of planet, though perhaps three rather than the five suggested, otherwise game balance might suffer. Gaia is one suggestion for a new planet type, there is at least one more possible and some specials:

-Radioactive planets could only be colonised with a higher level tech, they might allow combat bonuses to the owner.

-Phase planets appear for a random period of time either in one grav well or another, or both at the same time! Might be combined with wormholes (and why not have one way or reversible wormholes/phase lanes?)

-The Lair is where the space beasts spawn to wreak havoc throughout the galaxy!

-Spectral planet, the home of the Flying Dutchmen. Only elite crews can tolerate the fear it produces, regular crews become spectre ships on entry to the grav well. Sends fear down the phase lanes reducing culture- if colonised this stops, but it needs several culture structures to maintain any colony.

-Harmony planet, no combat until colonised, enhances culture structures.

-Ancestors planet, the planet is itself a relic, so two discoveries instead of just one. Perhaps some form of Guardian...?

-Glass planet, the entire planet is a mirror which produces a hostile copy of each ship the first time it enters the grav well. It is possible to colonise it, with a minimal population, if it becomes neutral it reverts to its old behaviour. It has collected a defensive fleet.

-Phase Maelstrom, expands slowly to cover the entire grav well at maximum then contracts, any ship caught is pulled to the centre and held until it vanishes, taking damage. The Maelstrom returns to the grav well at random intervals.

The suggestion that colonies convert due to culture instead of just turn neutral might improve the game, perhaps there could be the requirement that a special prophet/propaganda ship have been present for some time when the colony turns for this to happen.

More victory conditions seems like a good suggestion, it would help in the construction of a campaign- perhaps holding all the relics or conquering a specific planet. Perhaps there could be a cultural level of victory, 'doom', where you have to achieve enough believers/consumers/nomads and construct a giant temple at your capital? Other factions then have some time to destroy it... The suggested game clock would help, then there could also be 'space invaders' style hold out games, useful for the campaign.

One problem with the later game is that if a player survives its too easy to have the remaining AI factions fight each other because of a high reputation. The player should have 0% reputation after breaking a ceasefire, and also suffer penalties to relations with other factions when breaking (or just losing) any alliance or treaty.

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The 2nd expansion

What are your ideas about it?