Countering (attacking) large AI fleets

I don't play many strategy games because they just annoy the piss out of me with all their micromanagement, so I'm not very experienced with them. I know there are already a lot of "I'm a newb, babysit me" threads here, so I'll try to be more focused.

I can pretty much destroy the AI on a small 1v1 map by completely ignoring research, building a small frigate fleet, and rushing them. But on maps large enough that the AI has time to build up its own fleet, I can't seem to make any headway. The bum rush doesn't work as well, and if I take the time to build my defenses and research to make a large fleet of my own, the problem just seems to get worse.

I want to love this game because of the potential for some long, drawn out engagements on large maps with large fleets, but so the agravation hasn't been worth it. Any advice?

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Make a super fleet

And most important: Don't use only capital ships... It may seem like a good idea, but it's not

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This is a long game, take the time, build up your fleet. Trick is to trap their fleet by using a smaller fleet to get his attention then ambush that with the larger assault fleet. After attacking an enemy world consolidate it. Then move forward. You want the AI to commit its forces then proceed him to give a defeat in detail. i usually use a smaller fleet thats decent at taking down caps combined with an assault fleet that more for taking down the caps' supporting frigs and cruisers.

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I generally have two fleets: A defensive fleet that hangs back in a central location or around a contested planet, and an offensive fleet that is at least twice the size of the defensive fleet and preferrably 3 times as large. The defensive fleet is supported by several Hangar Defenses and PJIs to trap intruders. When attacking, I normally send a small contingent ahead of my main fleet. The computer doesnt like fair fights so when he sees the small attack force he throws everything at it. As he's rushing out to crush them, my offensive fleet jumps in and I have all ships concentrate fire on the nearest cap ship until its dead. Then the next one. You can usually get 2 or 3 cap ships before he jumps out and then take the planet. Rinse and repeat.

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Pirates...use the pirates! I consistently find myself getting ganged up on when I play with multiple AI opponents on a medium map. I typically use two fleets to watch over my empire and then have a collection of fast moving ships sitting somewhere in the middle. Those fast moving ships intercept enemy attackers to slow them down long enough for one of the two main fleets to arrive and mop up the invaders. In rare cases I have to turn that group of fast moving ships into a third fleet when I'm seriously getting ganged up on badly. Otherwise, they normally just stay mobile so that either them or another fleet can come in to flank the enemy if they come after me. The worse the attacks, the more bounty I put out. Eventually this allows the pirates to invade and wipe out an undefended AI location. It's a sneaky way of getting essentially another fleet of friendly vessels behind enemy lines. The AI will eventually stop their attack in order to defend their assets. If you've got jump inhibitors you can do some serious damage while the AI is trying to fall back.

The key is definitely how to manipulate the pirates in your favor. If you're dealing with multiple AI attacks plus pirates, then I don't think you're going to be around for long. If you turn the pirates against the AI there's commonly a hole behind enemy lines that will get exploited by them and cause enough panic for you to recover or chase down the enemy. You will have to endure some attacks, but if you can hold out then the tide of war will change in your favor.

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which reminds me, if your playing advent on a largish map get karmic retribution upgrade for your tradeship. for some reason the AI loves to kill them as they pass through a system. that AI bounty will be up to 50K + in no time at all.

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I agree with the thoughts posted above -- don't underestimate the power of well defended planets. I typically identify the key entry-points into my space and super-fortify those planets/asteroids. It's amazing what 12 turrets, a few hangers and a repair platform (along with an antimatter generator if you're playing the Advent in the late game) can do to help a small fleet stand up against a vastly superior force. When it comes to going on the offensive, I tend to invest in quality -- along with having cap ships, I like to build heavy cruisers (my favorite is probably the Advent's Daestra Crusader). A fleet composed of the right ships can stand up to forces twice their size while sustaining minimal losses.

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The computer doesnt like fair fights so when he sees the small attack force he throws everything at it.

LOL. Have you ever read 'The Art of War'? There is no such thing as a "fair fight" when your civilization is as stake. Do you think the US would hesitate to use nuclear weapons if they were losing a conventional war that threatened their entire way of life?

It's very smart to use all your forces to attack something, no matter how small - it minimizes your losses. Obvious exceptions to this are when the enemy has "area-of-effect" weapons, or another path in behind you.

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Heh. The only "fair fight" is one that I'll win.

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I don't usually seem to run into problems defending my planets, especially since the AI is so prone to running away when the backup fleet gets there. I seem to have all my problems offensively (in retrospect, I should have titled the thread "Attacking large AI fleets"). I can't figure if it's my choice of ships, or if I'm just cursed.

Perhaps it'll be more helpful if I use an example of a loss I suffered, and let you tell me why I lost (this will be kinda long, but I really appreciate the help).

During a 1v1 TEC v TEC with an easy enemy AI, spent a lot on the pirates, allowed them to build up their numbers in their home sector, then used a novalith to kill their base, eliminating the raids but leaving that sector so overwhelmed that the AI wouldnt attempt to cross it. This resulted in the AI being almost completely cut off with only 2 planets.

My scout ships allowed me to see that the AI's fleet was made up almost entirely of carrier cruisers. Based on strategies I had (mis)read on these forums, I filled my fleet out with mainly with flak frigates (about 60% of the fleet, for the fighter/bomber swarm), kodiaks, and lrms, not counting caps. I sent the flaks in first on one side of the phase lane to attract the fighters. After the enemy fleet got moving, I brought the rest of my fleet in behind them and had them target the caps.

I destroyed all of the enemy cap ships, then promptly had my fleet wiped out. By the end, the counters for the enemy fleet showed only a slight decrease in the number of carriers. With so few planets, I figured the AI couldn't possibly have kept supply going fast enough to maintain that, but I was wrong. So why was I wrong, why did I lose?

Too long version: fighters killed my flaks, wtf?

Side note, on my second attempt, I sent a small contingent of kodiaks into the pirate sector. Killed enough pirates that the entire AI fleet rushed the sector. I jumped the K's out and allowed the remaining pirates to soften up the AI, then brought the remainder of my fleet in, while the group of repaired K's when to the pirate homeworld and destroyed reinforcements as they were produced. I still got wiped out.

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